Mattie McGrath (Tipperary South, Independent)

Yes. I was having a bit of jocose banter with the Minister.

I reiterate we must have political separation at all times. The dormant accounts fund was distributed without fear or favour to many projects and that is mentioned in the Bill. There must be a clear distinction. Like everything else in the country, there is political lobbying for it. It would not be the nature of the work otherwise, from the community up to the county and urban councils and on to us, as Deputies. At the same time there must be a line that can never be crossed.

From the figures I mentioned, there is one about which I am sceptical. It featured in the Minister's speech. I hate to criticise it because I am for rationalisation, streamlining and cutting out red tape. The outside is red tape and what is on the inside is like bailing twine stuck in a bailer. It is at the heart and one cannot get it out. That is where we must go - into that bailing twine, the nylon stuff that is tied up inside official Ireland. It does not come from the elected Government - I was a member of the last Government; the Minister belongs to this one - but that official clasp is like a seal around the heart of things. There is Vaseline or some kind of wax over it and we need a hammer and chisel to break it. It must be broken, however, or the country will go down. We will kill the entrepreneurial spirit of business people, on the one hand, and volunteers and community groups on the other. They are struggling and worried. The media worries them with mention of the cuts in store. These are the people without whom we cannot survive. They are at the match tonight, supporting our team. They give hope to us, to our children and to community groups.

I appeal to the Minister to be mindful of that. He knows this better than I do and I thank him for meeting Muintir na Tíre and other such groups since he came to his ministry. He knows what to do in any case, and has good people in his own area. I referred to a namesake of his. They do great work in their volunteering role. They did so last year with Community Alert in inclement weather.

I commend the Bill and thank Members for listening to me.

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