Joe McHugh (Donegal North East, Fine Gael)

My colleague, Deputy Timmy Dooley, who was on this side now looks more relaxed. I remember that in government he always looked stressed and worried, but he even smiles now and again. Bing in opposition gives one that luxury. When one enters government, it is important one should realise what one can do.

Some commentators have pointed out that the Government is not doing enough in the European Union. However, we can only do what we are able to do. We have to try to put our house in order and we do not need political experts to point this out to us. We needed a general election to listen to the people on the doorsteps. I was asked, "Joe, are you mad going for election?" As Deputy Wallace said, we have inherited a poisoned chalice, a problem which it will take ten, 15 or 20 years to sort out. I was told it would be an incredible job and a mammoth task and asked how we were going to do it. I have run in three elections and it was the first in which people did not know what was going to happen. There was fear. In 1999 I ran in the local elections and people gave their opinion on what was going to happen. In 2002 I ran in the Seanad election and they talked about the future. During the recent election they feared they did not know what was going to happen because of the international dynamic - the Chinese, the American dollar and the euro. Everything has become global. The only opinion being offered was that we should clean up our mess. We are cleaning it up, but it will take time, as the Minister of State, Deputy Hayes, pointed out. In the short time we have been in office we have decided to decouple from the likes of Greece and Portugal in terms of international confidence. People are pointing to Ireland, but not, as some on the other side of the House have said, as a goody two shoes looking up to European leaders and the best boy in the class. Such a view is nonsense.

We have to get our fiscal strategy right. Obviously, there are challenges at European level, which is what the Bill is about. If passed, €440 billion will be put into a fund to stabilise an ongoing complicated and dangerous journey. Will €440 billion be enough? I do not know the answer, it may not be. Some experts think trillions of euro will be needed to deal with the matter, but that is an issue to be considered in the future.

The future realm of politics is a dangerous zone, because we could spend considerable time expending energy on discussion on what might happen down the line. If we were such great experts on predicting what would happen in future we would go into the grocery shop every day to buy lottery tickets. However, we are gaining a reputation for the work we are trying to do. This is work that needs to be done to stabilise our economy. We need to get away from the idea that in order to do something we need a consultant or an expert. For example, over a 12 or 13-year period the Department of Social Protection spent between €12 million and €13 million on consultant reports. We need to listen attentively to the people on the street, who still know there is waste and there is a job to be done. They know there is still considerable pain ahead in getting things sorted out, but they are realistic in understanding that we need to do something about it.

I am the first to admit there has been plenty of procrastination on a European fiscal management programme. Perhaps there is dithering because it is new territory and people may not know where the project is going, of which we need to be conscious. I am critical of the leadership at European level. Important ECOFIN meetings take place. The Taoiseach has been representing us as recently as last August, when he agreed to introduce this legislation before the end of September. He is committed to that aspect of the European project. If there is to be a fiscal realignment in Europe, the reputation we are building and the consistency of our argument will ensure that we have to look after our own interests, including the 12.5% corporation tax rate.

I refer back to what I said earlier about the healthy scepticism for the European project in Donegal. Donegal is not dissimilar to other counties along the coast, on the periphery of Ireland and the periphery of Europe. The main argument during the campaign on the Lisbon treaty referendum was over how much of our fishing rights we had given away. People pointed to the number of French and Spanish boats coming into our waters. I will make the same argument in government as I made consistently in opposition. As I have told the Minister for Agriculture, Fisheries and Food, Deputy Coveney, we need to be more bolshie in re-establishing ourselves as a fishing nation. If there is to be a fiscal realignment or a fiscal adjustment and if give and take is required in different areas, it is important that we put the fisheries debate back on the agenda. I say that as a Government backbencher who feels I have a role to play as a conduit for getting the message to Government, especially one with such a large majority. We need to ensure we have the confidence to do that because over the years of protracted negotiation on the CFP, we have lost out considerably on fishing.

With respect to the crystal ball, some of the stuff is fantastical. The Sinn Féin manifesto did not want the EU and IMF money. It planned on using €15 billion of the national reserves and taking €15 billion from the Central Bank. It wanted to use that €30 billion to take us through to the end of the year. We are nearly at the end of the year - the €30 billion would have been gone and there would be no money in the National Pensions Reserve Fund, there would be no money from the EU-IMF and we could not have gone back to the market. We need to get real about what we can do. We need to look in our own backyard before we start a debate about stuff where nobody really knows what will happen.

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