Simon Coveney (Cork South Central, Fine Gael)

----- but it would have been unlikely that we would have seen a climate change Bill or a draft Bill next week if it had not been for the consistent and determined work of the Joint Committee on Climate Change and Energy Security to force the Government to publish something. That is unfortunate. With no disrespect to the Minister of State, it is also unfortunate that we do not have either of the two senior Green Party Ministers present for the debate. To have a Cabinet Member present making commitments on behalf of the Cabinet and the Government would have been helpful in adding credibility to what is being said by Government parties.

I am sure many people in Ireland today, if they were listening to the debate this afternoon or were reading what we are debating, would ask themselves what climate change has to do with the enormous challenges that Ireland faces now. It is a more difficult challenge for us, but an equally important one, to convince the public, business people, people who find themselves out of work and people struggling financially that carbon emissions and the problems they create are still relevant to the running of Ireland in the midst of an economic, employment and fiscal crisis. I say to these people that this is the case. I am conscious of the fact that parties such as mine, the Labour Party and Fianna Fáil have more of a responsibility, as so-called mainstream large parties, to sell this message than does perhaps the Green Party, with respect, because people already know and understand its views in this area.

A number of people state the last thing we need now is Green Party policy and that we need to get back to building a mainstream economy. This thought process misses the point. The reality is that the future of the Irish economy will not be built on doing what we did successfully in the past. Building roads, houses, hotels and factories will not solve Ireland's problems. What we need to build in Ireland is a new economy, built on clever thinking, efficiency, telecommunications and all of the technologies that will provide employment in the future to provide incomes for families in Ireland. We need to change our education system to prepare for this. The so-called "green agenda" sold by the Green Party is a much bigger issue than Green Party politics; it is mainstream politics and involves a mainstream economy. Anybody who thinks the Irish economy can progress and ignore the opportunities of which we can take advantage in this crisis is very naive.

What this debate and Bill is about is saying to people that we want, on an all-party basis, to commit future governments to a consistent and determined course of action which will fundamentally change the way in which the Irish economy functions, the way in which Irish people and Irish families operate and live, the way in which we move around, the way in which we produce food, and the way in which we communicate with each other. All of these have an impact on our environment and on the energy that provides for our lifestyles.

I take the point about the need for regulation and for persuasion on the need to change lifestyle, but ultimately what is required is certainty. One cannot rely on regulation and persuasion without a requirement to deliver on targets set down in law because we all know how politics works. When times get tough the easy decisions are taken, the easy cutbacks are made, and the invisible savings that are often the most calamitous in terms of their long-term impact are the soft options taken by Government. We need to cut expenditure and raise taxes to the tune of approximately €15 billion over the next four years. After this the challenge will continue. It is in this context we must ensure climate change and all of the issues and responsibilities around it are more than a feature - that they are a central plank in any Government's future overall economic strategy. I was sceptical at the start of this process about the need for climate change law. I thought that if governments do not meet their targets there was not much we could do about it, such as putting them in jail, for instance. However, I have changed my view completely. Our Bill proposes a legal obligation on the Taoiseach to set targets, to ensure that his Government meets those targets. We are asking any future Taoisigh to continue to do this by setting five-year carbon budgets and meeting legal obligations. This sends a strong signal to those who want to invest in the Irish economy, to invest in renewable energy, one of the few areas with significant private investment capital and gives such people certainty that the political and economic direction being taken by Ireland is consistent with their interests. If the climate change challenge is to be linked with economic recovery and job creation in law, this will give certainty to investors.

Unless the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government, Deputy Gormley, has changed his mind, there is still a difference of opinion as to how to deal with climate change law. I know there are reservations within the Green Party about giving the primary responsibility to the office of the Taoiseach. I suspect the Government view will be that the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government, or a Minister for climate change, will be a climate change champion to win the arguments in Cabinet, set targets and make things happen. This may well work, depending on the personalities around the Cabinet table but it may well not work if the Minister with responsibility for this area is not sufficiently persuasive or powerful of if a Taoiseach dismisses this argument.

I am in agreement with my colleague, Deputy McManus, who has been very good on this issue, that the ultimate responsibility needs to lie with the head of Government. This is the main issue in this legislation. I ask the Minister of State to make the arguments that have been agreed in the all-party Joint Committee on Climate Change and Energy Security. The appropriate politician in Ireland to set down the ground rules and the targets, the performance indicators, is the Taoiseach, supported by an independent commission and by an office for climate change and energy security within the Department of the Taoiseach. This means the leader of Government, who is a member of a mainstream political party, with credibility outside niche environmental sectors will decide the policy as to what makes economic sense for Ireland in the face of the economic challenges over the next four to five years and also for the next 40 and 50 years. I also agree with the target set in the draft legislation of an 80% lower emissions figure by 2050 from a base year figure of 1990.

I hope we make progress in certain aspects as a result of today's debate. I hope we can give a message to the Government that any legislation needs to be supported by all political parties in this House because the likely scenario is that at some stage in the next 12 months there will be a new Government. I am not arrogant enough to say who will be in this Government.

We are passing legislation in a very unusual way. For the first time in my political experience - with the possible exception of Northern Ireland issues - we are trying to put together legislation which all parties will buy into and will support if in Government in the future. We are trying to put a new institutional framework in place that can survive different parties in Government with different agendas, priorities and ideology over the next 40 years. It is regrettable that the Government has decided to adopt the tactic that it will not accept a draft Bill from the all-party committee which it could change and amend but instead has decided to produce its own Bill. I hope the Government will take the elements of this Bill which it can live with and produce a Bill that mirrors what the committee and the rapporteur in particular has tried to do over the past 12 months. No political party and no Minister has a monopoly of wisdom on this issue. We should not try to play politics nor look for recognition or thanks for being the first to introduce a climate change Bill. For the first time in our history we should aim for Government and Opposition, collectively, putting together legislation which all future Governments will be able to implement.

See this speech in context