Mary White (Carlow-Kilkenny, Green Party)

Mo bhuíochas do na comhleacaithe a thug deis dom a bheith páirteach sa díospóireacht seo.

I welcome the decision - taken less than a week ago - of Fine Gael Deputies to voluntarily give up their ministerial pensions. This was the most practical and effective remedy advocated by my party's leader, the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government, Deputy Gormley. I welcome a similar decision that was taken by senior Labour Deputies last week.

The Green Party has always believed that pensions are earned during one's working life and are paid when one ceases to work. We have always objected to sitting Members of the Dáil and Seanad also being paid so-called "pensions". Such a scenario is a travesty at any time, even during years of economic boom. At a time when ordinary working people are suffering, it is reprehensible. We have never benefited from that system. However, senior politicians of many parties - including those from Fine Gael and Labour - did benefit from these dual payments.

We always supported ending the practice of sitting Deputies and Senators claiming pensions. However, the legal advice received by the Government last year - which was renewed in recent weeks - indicated that ending this practice by the legislative route would give rise to a legal minefield. We were obliged to accept that these pensions could be only reduced and not abolished. Our leader, Deputy Gormley, always said there was a simple remedy in this regard, namely, instead of talking about new laws, those receiving such pensions could simply give them up. Many politicians did that some time ago and last week, senior figures in this House, including those in the sponsor party of this motion, did so. Effectively, they took Deputy Gormley's advice of almost one year ago, which I welcome.

I am far less impressed by the belated and bogus attempts by Fine Gael and Labour to seize the moral high ground on an issue they neglected for decades in government and opposition. Fine Gael and Labour were in government for a large portion of the 1980s and 1990s. While they could have reformed the system then, they did not. For many years but in particular for the past year, they could have led by example on this vexed issue and voluntarily given up such pensions. However, many of their Members preferred to call for new laws that they knew to be problematic. What a cynical device that was and the motion under debate takes such cynicism to a new low. Deputy Kenny should have listened to my colleague, Deputy Gogarty, who called for pay cuts for Ministers and Deputies. However, the leader of Fine Gael, Deputy Kenny, dismissed it as "populist nonsense". One week later, sensing public opinion, Deputy Kenny changed his mind. However it was too late as the Government already had decided to take the initiative. For weeks there was silence from Fine Gael on pensions. Now however, running with the hare and hunting with the hounds, this populist motion has crawled forth, ignoring all constitutional barriers.

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