Dick Roche (Wicklow, Fianna Fail)

When this provision was being framed by those who drew up our Constitution, I do not believe they had it in mind that the matter of pay for judges should be put outside the considerations that apply to the population as a whole, that judges be considered as a particular class beyond the considerations that apply to other citizens or that the pay of all judges should be exempt from the considerations that apply elsewhere. The Government has decided that, in the light of the findings of the review body, there will be no increase in judges' pay during the lifetime of the Government. I, for one, would have hoped that a way to apply those considerations that will be applied to the clerks in the courts and to the clerical and other support staff in the courts could have been found.

I also want to make reference to the debate on State-sponsored bodies. The Minister referred to the recent public discussion about pay rates in the commercial State-sponsored bodies and he outlined the manner in which the pay arrangements in these bodies are determined. In our current context it is important that here, too, those who determine pay levels are conscious of their responsibilities. While the pay of the employees of the commercial State-sponsored bodies may not come from taxation, their costs are passed on to customers, citizens and businesses. It is my belief that the pay levels at the top of the commercial State-sponsored bodies need separate review. The argument is made that curtailing pay in these bodies would drive talent away. I do not believe that argument has any sustainable support.

On the general issue, another issue which, to be fair, has been dealt with by Deputy Bruton for which I give him credit and one area where I fully agree with him, it is 40 years since a radical reform of public administration in this country was proposed in the Devlin report. Regrettably, many of the changes proposed in that report have never been applied. In another life, I wrote and lectured extensively on the Devlin report and on the subsequent reform proposals,-----

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