Dick Roche (Wicklow, Fianna Fail)

I thank all the Deputies who made contributions to this important debate which comes on the heels of a referendum where an extraordinary amount of people voted. I was amazed at Deputy Ó Snodaigh's views about the referendum, but then I am very frequently amazed at his views. I will come back to it. An astonishing number of people voted. It was the highest number of people to vote "Yes" in a referendum on a European proposition. It was an astonishing turnout.

We are also approaching a very important European Council meeting. Since the referendum Europe has begun to refocus its views of Ireland in a very positive way. The road that has lead to this point has been a long and tortuous one, going right back to the European Council in December 2000 and followed by the Laeken Declaration the following year, which attempted to put flesh on the ideas. The idea discussed at that time was how we would bring Europe closer to its citizens and deal with the apparent deficit in terms of democracy within Europe. The idea goes back even further than the European Council meeting itself. As I recall, prior to that, Mr. Joschka Fischer had launched a paper at the Humbert University in Berlin to discuss the same issue.

The Laeken Declaration was an interesting starting point in that it spoke of the need for the Union to come closer in every way to its citizens and their needs. Normally, as all in this House know, institutional treaties have been produced by intergovernmental conferences - it is frequently said they are produced in smoke filled rooms, which is not the case, but they have all been produced in private conferences except on this occasion. Those like Deputy Ó Snodaigh who somehow denigrate the process that went into the preparation of this treaty should look at the history. The reality was that from 2002 to 2003 there was an extraordinary innovation in the Convention on the Future of Europe. That involved not just Government representatives but also parliamentarians from across the entire Union, its institutions and civil society. It was open and transparent, and conducted its work in public. For somebody to suggest that somehow this process was hidden from the public is simply at variance with the facts.

Ireland's case was unique because the Irish delegation was made up not just of Government representatives but also of representatives from all of the major political parties. I had the honour to lead the Irish delegation and it was an extraordinary experience to work with colleagues from across this House, with people bringing different viewpoints. I well remember Proinsias de Rossa persuading me to sit in on the Social Europe group just to hear the debate there - I had actually asked to be transferred to it. When I listened to the debate in this country in recent weeks, I could not understand why some people could not have it within themselves to accept that this had been something that was unique.

The convention can be credited with putting a completely different emphasis on the preparation of the treaty. The division of competences in the Union was addressed, a point made by Deputy Timmins in his introductory comments when he referred to creeping federalism. The convention looked in detail at this very issue. The conventioneers who took the view that there should be a halt to that process won out, and this treaty reflects that. The convention was also focused on the simplification of the Union's instruments and on how we can work democratically to make the Union more transparent and efficient at the same time.

The Lisbon Treaty, of course, is the outcome not just of the convention but of two intergovernmental conferences. The first of those was under the Irish Presidency and the second followed the rejection of the treaty by the French and the Dutch. Another period of reflection followed the referendum here in Ireland in 2008. That period of reflection demonstrated what is good in Europe. If we recall the day the vote was taken last year, with a negative result, the very first response from Europe was that it must listen to the Irish people and respect their view, work with Ireland because it was not just an Irish problem, and work to see how the issues raised could be dealt with.

The response since then has been remarkably positive. It is a remarkable example of the solidarity that exists within the European Union. There was a willingness to sit down with us, to listen and to pay attention to what we asked for and make the necessary changes. The declarations, the various IGCs and periods of reflection, the conventions and the six referenda which have been held have all been important in illustrating to people who have somehow grown suspicious of the European project that, far from wanting to force itself on the people, it wants to be part and parcel of a public evolution of the new Europe.

The process has been painstaking. The European Union is a union of states and peoples. It is interesting to consider the work of the convention, where there was discussion as to the nature of the next treaty and whether it would be a constitution or otherwise. One point on which there was agreement was that Europe was, in fact, a unique initiative of peoples and nations. The nine-year process which is coming to fruition demonstrates the essentially democratic nature of the Union. Despite the setbacks, there was never any question of rushing the fences. At each stage, the democratic decision-making process of each member state was fully respected, which remains to this day. When problems were encountered, they were dealt with on the basis of respect and consultation. There was no bullying or attempt to bully or push people in any direction; there was simply respect. Whatever the obstacles, the 27 states took the time to talk, tease out the issue and move on.

The objectives set out nine years ago were ambitious and the needs identified were pressing, but the Union has recognised the need to be inclusive. As an organisation which is based on solidarity and shared values, there was little point in setting a pace which could not be matched by the member states. This is the essential genius of the European project. Despite all of the frustrations which emerged over the course of the negotiations and the numerous setbacks and false dawns along the way, the Union which emerges is stronger and more effective because its citizens can see it respected the difficulties, differences of opinion and different views which informed different member states' approaches to the issue.

With the Lisbon treaty, we now have a Union in which our shared values and objectives are set out clearly, equipped with institutions which will operate fairly and effectively, and tasked with the responsibilities whenever the member states decide action at the level of the Union works best, with clearly defined parameters setting out where it is best to leave issues at national or regional level. I go back to the point made by Deputy Timmins. It is interesting that one of the great innovations in this treaty was the very clear declaration of the conferral principal which makes it very clear we will not drift in the direction of a federal Europe which has its own powers, autonomous to the member states. It has powers which are conferred only by the member states.

In the nine years it has taken to bring this process to a conclusion, some of the challenges we face, such as climate change, have taken on an increased sense of urgency. In recent times the economic reality has caused us to check our position on Europe. However, the European Union which is about to come to life under the terms of the Lisbon treaty has been crafted in such a way as to give us the tools we badly need to deal with the big ticket issues, such as climate change, the economic downturn and cross-border crime. That is what the objectives of the Lisbon treaty were, with some changes made in terms of the responsibilities of the Union; there was no attempt to grab power from the member states.

In this debate, we are putting in place the final elements needed to bring a new European Union into life. We have made history along the way - no other European treaty received as much support in a referendum in this country as the Lisbon treaty did on 2 October - and we are making history here today. We are putting the finishing touches here in the House to a new era which will have an impact across Europe, in this country and in these Houses. The way we do business here and in the Seanad is set to change - I am thinking particularly of the contributions of Deputies Ulick Burke and Michael Kitt. No longer will it be the case that somewhere in the bureaucracy decisions are made without Parliament being fully involved. One of the extraordinary changes made by the Lisbon treaty is that this House and the Seanad - the two Houses of the Oireachtas - will be involved at a much earlier date in consideration of EU policies or draft legislation than is currently the case.

After the passage of the Bill, the House will have to examine the operation of these powers in management terms. The involvement of national parliaments in the European law-making process is one of the most welcome developments since we joined the Union. National parliaments will be able to intervene at a relatively early stage but they will also have to act relatively swiftly. This, of course, presents an opportunity for this House and the Seanad, but also represents a real responsibility for both Houses to respond to the electorate's requirements. One of the extraordinary things that will happen under the new arrangements is that people who are concerned about European law will have a much better capacity to deal with the issues.

Before I conclude, I wish to deal with some of the specific issues raised. Deputies Timmins and Costello spoke at the outset about their concerns on section 4. To clarify, this section simply updates section 3 of the 1972 Act to take account of the new arrangements under the Lisbon treaty. I take Deputy Costello's point that the Labour Party was opposed to the 2007 amendment which made it permissible in implementing regulations to provide for indictable offences. I too had some concerns about that measure at the time, but the issue was debated in the House, a decision was made and it is now law. Section 4 of this Bill introduces no substantive change in this but simply reaffirms the arrangement in the Lisbon treaty.

I take this opportunity again to compliment Deputies Creighton, Costello and Timmins on their personal roles in the successful outcome of the second referendum on the Lisbon treaty. Deputy Creighton referred to two specific issues in her contribution, namely, transposition and the scrutiny system. The scrutiny system in this House is not perfect and I agree with the Deputy that it must be overhauled. On transposition, Ireland is now within the 1% level and we have improved significantly.

I do not accept the points made by Deputy Ó Snodaigh. The recent referendum campaign produced, at 59%, one of the highest ever turn-outs in a European referendum. Aggregating the results from the two referenda shows that 57.4% of voters supported the treaty and 42.6% voted "No". As well as achieving a very high turnout, this was one of the highest "Yes" votes since 1992.

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