Jim O'Keeffe (Cork South West, Fine Gael)

I know there are problems regarding evidence and so on. In any serious situation one will come up against problems. Our job is to try to find solutions. That means accepting there is a serious problem and being prepared to find a solution.

I would like a new examination of how we categorise crime. There should be some way to categorise violent crime and serious crime that is not just indictable crime carrying a penalty of more than five years. We need some way to make things clear so that the Members of this House, the Government of the day - I am not sure how long this one will last - and the public will be reminded of the extent of the problem and the need to confront it.

Another worrying development is the growth of regional enclaves. The Garda would object if I said these places were "no-go areas", as it is an incorrect description. Where drug lords, crime barons and vicious criminals are the overlords in the area and hold sway to a considerable extent over the decent people in the community, we must sit up and take notice. Unfortunately, the town of Limerick, which is a capital as far as rugby is concerned, is also a byword for areas where these people have considerable sway. There are other parts of the country in a similar situation, including parts of this city. We must accept that these people are effectively outside the law. When I was young and I read stories about the wild west, such people were known as outlaws. These people today are outlaws as they do not respect the rule of law.

We are facing a huge threat to our society, and I do not think we have confronted it adequately. We must mobilise all our forces to do so. We did it when there was a threat from the IRA. That organisation was attempting to subvert the State and its institutions because it did not recognise its courts and so on. It was confronted and a common view was formed among most elected representatives at the time that it had to be confronted. A similar attitude must be taken to this problem, which means accepting that the threat is there and that there is no simple solution to it, but looking at the component parts of the solution. There is no simplistic way such as internment. I do not think it worked during the last period of subversion of the State and I do not think it will work this time. We must try to work within the rule of law, change the law as required and provide the resources as required. That is the only way.

We need to look at where we can improve the law, which includes serious consideration of this Bill, which I accept is an honest effort. However, there are many other areas to be examined. Why are we so dilatory and tardy in doing the things that everybody accepts should be done when it comes to law reform? DNA is a marvellous tool in the fight against crime, so why have we not got the database, the forensic laboratory or the legislation required? I do not want to hop political footballs, but we are constantly told that great work is being done and then we get the legislative programme every session, in which we are told that the legislation required is expected by Christmas. Is that Christmas 2009 or when? I have always taken an interest in this issue. I looked back over the legislative programme over the past few years and I found the criminal justice (DNA database) Bill, which was to provide for the establishment of a DNA database and was expected to be published in 2006. I know there are problems with recent legislation - there is also a case in the UK - but our job is to get over these problems and we must mobilise a much more urgent effort to overcome them.

The same issue arises regarding procedural reform. There are references to the Special Criminal Court. I do not know whether the use of the Special Criminal Court for gangland crime is the panacea that some people think it is. If it will provide an improvement, I am all for it. That court was mainly necessary due to the intimidation of jurors. The problem with gangland crime has not mainly been about intimidation of jurors, but rather intimidation of witnesses, although I am open to correction on this. If it will help, bring it on. If there are constitutional problems, as the Taoiseach hinted recently, then we should hear about them so we can find a solution to them. We have a committee dealing with the Constitution and if there are problems, this is a useful forum in which we can confront them and find a solution. Let us not just be broadly hinting at and talking about a solution. If the Special Criminal Court is part of the solution, then let us agree on it. If there are problems, let us overcome them.

I have also been in favour of electronic tagging. I can recall some interesting discussions about this, including discussions with the current Leas-Cheann Comhairle when he talked about the technical difficulties at the time. There are technical difficulties in dealing with electronic tagging, but they have been overcome in other countries. Ultimately, we succeeded in getting legislative provision for electronic tagging, but where are the electronic tags? We must have invisible electronic tags. Putting the legislation in place is only half the job. If there are technical problems, then we should overcome them as was done in other countries. Why have we not overcome them? Let us have the complete package and let us put it into operation.

I know that the country is half bankrupt from the activities of Fianna Fáil for the last ten years, but-----

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