Martin Mansergh (Tipperary South, Fianna Fail)

The Government, on the recommendation of the Taoiseach, decides on the number and role of Ministers of State. There is no doubt that the demands on Government and on its members have grown hugely over the past 40 years and that there is much value in cross-departmental co-ordination but we are also living at a time when the overhead costs of running the State have to be cut back.

I was the first Minister of State to intervene in this debate last January, partly because responsibility in the Department of Finance makes me acutely conscious of the financial situation facing the country. Before ever I had the honour to be appointed a Minister of State, I would have held the view that in an ideal world, the number of junior and senior Ministers would correspond. As someone who is both the most junior ranking Minister of State but also having one of the longest political involvements going back to 1981, albeit most of that time in an unelected, advisory capacity, I wished to be helpful to the Taoiseach in terms of creating political elbow room should the Government wish or need to cut numbers. Several colleagues made similar points.

There are alternative ways to cut overheads, including the 10% salary cut and pension levy, to which all Ministers are subject, the 10% cut being the equivalent in salary terms of a reduction of two Ministers of State. Many people in the constituency, and especially in the Tipperary electoral area, from where I come and where I am the first officeholder since independence, might not have thanked me for my offer. The men and women from Tipperary who helped bring about a revolution that led to independence were unselfish and I would rather emulate them than the class from which I am descended.

The Opposition motion, and some of my backbench colleagues, would be more radical. Time may tell, if and when Fine Gael enter a coalition Government with others, whether they would practice what they now preach. I would not for short-term popularity advocate changes so severe that would seriously impair the effectiveness of Government.

I try to run my constituency work in the most economical manner without employing permanent civil servants. I use the same three people who worked for me when I was a backbench Deputy, the only difference being that two of them who were job-sharing in Tipperary and Clonmel, respectively, are now full-time. I use my own car which I bought in 2006. I had no drivers for the first three and a half months in order to save money and I arrange my logistics so as to minimise overnight expenses. This year, I will travel to the ASEM conference, which I have been requested to attend by the Minister for Finance, economy class. I claim travel expenses which are conservatively estimated far below the maximum ceiling to which I might be entitled. Like many colleagues, I have to heavily subsidise the rental of my two constituency offices.

While we all have something to contribute, none of us are indispensable, even those with a substantial workload. The Office of Public Works, founded in 1831, is an important branch of Government in its own right with an annual budget commensurate with some smaller Departments. Its budget has now been cut back under my stewardship to half a billion euro from over €700 million a year ago. It has responsibility for public procurement, flood relief works, much of the State's built heritage and the provision and maintenance of public buildings.

Given current economic and financial difficulties, a substantial parliamentary load relating to the Department of Finance, including informally delegated responsibility for many areas, as well as representing the Minister and the Government at a number of conferences at home and abroad, has been devolved to me. With regard to the arts, where there is often an overlap of OPW responsibility, I am invited to launch and attend many cultural events. Through all my work there is also, by reason of past roles, a significant North-South dimension.

Across the board, in both the public and private sectors, the terms and conditions of employment for many people improved greatly during the Celtic tiger years, including for politicians. Now is a time for pruning back, in order to encourage healthy economic growth in the future, but the Government has to decide where best to do so.

We must stop denigrating our democratic institutions. I would be in favour of maintaining our indirectly elected Seanad as a constitutional safeguard and I agreed with everything Deputy Michael D. Higgins had to say in that regard. Many countries operate list systems which means only a minority of politicians are directly elected by the people. If there were more interest in and reporting of policy debates rather than just power play and personality clash the debates in the Dáil, Seanad and committees would be better covered.

I look forward to a dedicated TV channel. Political skills are needed not just in identifying the right solution but also in winning sufficient public support for them. Despotism, enlightened or otherwise, is not an acceptable alternative to accountable democratic politics.

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