Alan Shatter (Dublin South, Fine Gael)

It is essential that we have accountability. We should be conscious of the changing corporate status of Anglo Irish Bank.

I wish to make a declaration of interest. Unlike many, I am in the fortunate position of not being a shareholder in Anglo Irish Bank. In case anyone accuses me of not making a declaration of interest, I have earned no money from the dreadful debacle that has occurred. The law firm with which I still have a connection has received inquiries from shareholders as to where they stand on their entitlement to compensation.

I have had conversations with two or three journalists about the issue. Someone may say in the future I contributed to the debate in circumstances where others in the law firm with which I am associated may act on behalf of shareholders; I do not know whether or not that will come to pass.

We should be conscious of the new structure to be put in place. It is useful to discuss this amendment in the context of the scandalously truncated debate we had on Second Stage. It gives us an opportunity to address the conduct of those involved with this bank.

This bank is going into State ownership. As a consequence, there should be no obstacle to a proper examination of its books, its historical dealing and its paperwork relating thereto. Regarding Mr. FitzPatrick, there should be no obstacle to a clear examination as to how it came to pass that, as shown in the books of the bank, substantial sums of money were borrowed, seemed to disappear out of sight in September each year before the bank came to the end of its financial year, found their way into the books of Irish Nationwide Building Society and were then transferred mysteriously back into the bank after 30 September each year.

The usual reason for appointing an inspector is when a company has its own identifiable independent legal status and requires an external investigation to ascertain what has happened within the company. I assume the Minister will confirm to the House that all necessary information will be accessed.

We have been told the Director of Corporate Enforcement is conducting some type of investigation. There are limits to where that investigation can go. I understand there is a separate and identifiable function for the Garda fraud squad. Can the Minister tell us if he envisages the Garda investigating the dealings within this company?

We know of the borrowings conducted by Mr. FitzPatrick through this company, but we do not have the full details. There were some revelations at the extraordinary general meeting held last Friday and others were discussed in the media, but we do not have the full detail.

One revelation we do know is that some of the borrowings relate to the acquisition of shares in Anglo Irish Bank. Those borrowings were off the books, never acknowledged, used to stimulate public confidence in the bank — presumably to persuade those who already held shares to retain them or buy more — and act as a catalyst to shareholders acquiring shares.

A particular criminal issue arises in those circumstances. Irish Nationwide Building Society should not be exempt from any investigation conducted. It may be acceptable that many millions of euro borrowed from a chairman or former chief executive of a bank be transferred from one financial institution to another for one year. There may be a business reason for doing so. It is reported this happened eight years in a row and always coincided with the end of the financial year for the other institution. The moneys were then transferred back.

Irish Nationwide Building Society and its management have serious questions to answer and I am astonished that, to date, they have not publicly explained their conduct. It is essential that conduct is explained.

There are many people who invested in the Irish stock market and purchased reasonable, not huge, amounts of shares in Anglo Irish Bank. Many were retired and relied on the dividend. They assumed investing in Anglo Irish Bank was investing in a company which was blue chip as any other bank, until the recent disasters which have taken place. I believe such people have been defrauded of their money.

Anyone who invests on the stock market must accept risk and understand that the value of shares goes up and down. By and large, if one makes the wrong judgment, money is lost and if the right judgment is made, money may be made. Shares have been artificially boosted.

Information has been excluded from accounts, there have been extraordinary failures by the auditors of the company and negligence on the part of the regulator who, even if the authority was unaware of what was happening for many years, knew exactly what the position was by December 2007. One section of the regulatory authority did not give the other side the information.

Many people face serious financial difficulties as a consequence of what has happened within this company. It should be completely unacceptable for a chairman or chief executive to arrange a loan book in this way and engage in the type of conduct we have seen.

We still do not know what assets are backing up the borrowings taken out. We do not know if the moneys Mr. FitzPatrick was moving by way of borrowings between Anglo Irish Bank and Irish Nationwide Building Society were borrowed by him for his own business purposes or if he was a front for making moneys available to other persons. We do not know the answers to any of these questions.

I would like an assurance from the Minister that there will be a proper investigation and follow up of these issues. I listened to the ramblings of the Minister for the Environment, Heritage and Local Government, Deputy John Gormley, and the vain attempt by the Minister for Communications, Energy and Natural Resources, Deputy Eamon Ryan, to distance the Green Party from responsibility of any nature. It is as if the Green Party only went into government six months ago.

There was a failure of corporate regulation of enormous proportions. The banking crisis we are confronted by continued to be stirred and contributed to by the Government in office. During its first 12 months, it did nothing to tackle the obvious difficulties which arose regarding public expenditure and the collapse of the property market. All of these matters are affecting our economy.

I do not want to make a Second Stage speech but I am interested to hear what the Minister has to say about this proposal and what steps he and the board will take to ensure the sweetheart deal Mr. FitzPatrick organised on his behalf for borrowings is investigated.

Corporate misconduct has undermined not just the credibility of Anglo Irish Bank but of this State and has done damage to other banks. What will happen to ensure those who engage in what I believe is not merely criminal but reckless conduct are fully and properly investigated?

Action should be taken on behalf of the good name of this country, the shareholders of this company who have been betrayed, the pension schemes which have lost money, affecting thousands of people who have also been betrayed and the employees at lower levels in Anglo Irish Bank. They sought to do business in a decent and honest way and were betrayed by those in charge of the company and the incompetence of directors, some of whom have now resigned and should have gone earlier.

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