Mary Hanafin (Dún Laoghaire, Fianna Fail)

I do not propose to accept the amendments. I appreciate fully the views of Members in saying the Combat Poverty Agency has done valuable work over the past 20 years. Nobody is questioning the work done by the agency through research, project work and the voice it gave to people experiencing poverty, a particular skill of the body. It also highlighted issues to Government.

Over those 20 years, new structures have been put in place and new methods to hear that voice have been implemented. There should be new ways to ensure research is carried out at a national and European level. Acting in good faith the Government decided in June 2007 to conduct a review to see what was the best role for the Combat Poverty Agency in the future and how it could integrate with all the other established structures. It considered how the work could continue to the best advantage of those people experiencing poverty. It was not a budget-related issue and was not about savings, so it would be wrong to see it that way.

The group spent over a year looking at all the issues and came up with clear proposals. The report states that linking the CPA and the National Economic and Social Development Office bodies would be viable but there are some strong caveats to this. The report explains how different their roles are, how there is a mismatch and how there is already an ongoing review of NESDO. Ultimately, under the recommendations heading, the review states that the steering group recommends that the Office for Social Inclusion and the Combat Poverty Agency should be integrated. It is a clear recommendation.

The recommendation goes on to indicate, importantly, that this would be to the "mutual strengthening and enhancement" of the bodies. I am the first to accept that the office of social inclusion must be enhanced and strengthened, which is also recognised in this report. The way of ensuring both bodies can work to the best interests of combating poverty is to ensure we merge them and use the best skills and expertise from both.

Different organisations and research has emerged over the years. This morning, for example, the EU Survey on Income and Living Conditions results for 2007 were published; this process was not available 20 years ago and it provides very valuable, objective and honest information, as does the live register. There are some figures to be worried about but there are also some very encouraging figures that I have no doubt we will discuss here at another time. These are just a few examples of the information available.

There is also Central Statistics Office research and reports and, more particularly, there is the social partnership process which has not only emerged but developed as a strong part of society and all our dealings with employers, workers and vulnerable or community groups. That community and voluntary pillar is now an essential part of the process, although it was not the case when the Combat Poverty Agency was established. We now have the social partnership deal of Towards 2016; the national action plans for social inclusion, the social inclusion elements of the national development plans and all the other structures.

I mentioned last week the social inclusion forum which gathered a few hundred people to do very practical and good work last week. We have the Cabinet committee on social inclusion and the various offices within Departments that deal with social inclusion, be it in my own Department or my former Department dealing with education. That did all the work on the DEIS schools. There is also the senior officials group, the EU open method of co-ordination and various groups now doing at least some of the work that the Combat Poverty Agency was doing. There was an overlap and it was legitimate to set up the review.

The recommendations are also very clear and I have adopted them. This is not about abolishing the Combat Poverty Agency but rather the abolition of poverty and the aim to eliminate it. It will be difficult in the times we are living in, which we recognise. As with any Minister in this position, I am to play my part in eliminating poverty, and this is linked in many ways to what we are doing. I want to ensure that as Minister, and with all future Ministers, we will have the best benefits of the very best research and expertise, as well as the voice of the people experiencing poverty. There should be a strong central unit within the Department of Social and Family Affairs that can advise Government and ensure all Departments are aware of the best policies to be taken.

Such a unit should initiate research on issues it believes important. I am a very strong advocate of ensuring we have independent research and evidence-based policies. That will mean investigating and carrying out research on issues that we may not yet have thought of. That is why I expect such a unit to come up with a very good work programme that will be part and parcel of what it must do. I expect the unit to formulate proposals and initiatives that Government agencies and Departments can take on board as part of our central policies.

There is some excellent expertise in both sections but it can become even better by merging the two bodies. In fairness to both the board and staff from the agency I have met, they are more than willing to ensure that expertise will be harnessed in a very positive way. They have particular skills in giving a voice to poverty, which the Department has not done in the past, per se. These people will be able to bring such expertise with them and ensure we can do it in future.

Research has been central both to the Department and the Combat Poverty Agency. The Department will give information to any Deputy and I mentioned some sources in the past week when we were on Committee Stage. Some of the pieces of research published recently by the Department include the Life Cycle Perspective on Social Inclusion in Ireland: An Analysis of EU-SILC; Tackling Low Income and Deprivation: Developing Effective Policies; and A Social Portrait of People of Working Age in Ireland. They are from this year, so we commission and publish valuable research, making it available to anybody interested in the public. This is not about silencing the voice of poverty or issues relating to it.

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