Brian Lenihan Jnr (Dublin West, Fianna Fail)

Deputy Bruton and Deputy Rabbitte asked about the definition of financial support, which is very widely drawn in the definition clause in the Bill. Financial support includes a loan, a guarantee, an exchange of assets and any other kind of financial accommodation or support. The purpose of the legislation is to give, in the public interest, powers to the Minister to maintain the stability of the financial system in the State. The envisaged method on foot of this legislation for immediate implementation is the scheme that will be submitted to the Oireachtas in accordance with the amendments tabled by Deputies Burton and Bruton.

The precise issue of wider powers arises because it is important that the legislation provides for the exercise of wider powers should the circumstances require it and that is why a wide definition of "financial support" is provided for in the legislation. If any such support were to involve recourse to the Exchequer, it would be essential for the House to divide and for appropriation of the relevant funds to take place for that to be effective. Under section 8, the Government has power to transfer a function of the Minister for Finance to the National Treasury Management Agency by order to exercise commercial operations of the type described as "financial support". That clarifies the functions of the NTMA in that regard. There is a view that the agency can carry out operations with the banks as matters stand but, to put the matter beyond doubt, especially in the context of financial instability, the agency can be assigned that function by the Government, although formally it is assigned to the Minister of Finance. I would not dream nowadays of doing any such thing because I do not have the relevant officers in my Department. They work for the NTMA on issues relating to public debt, bonds and securities and the management of funds.

The issue of making a report to the Committee of Public Accounts was also raised by Deputy Bruton. There is nothing to stop that committee or the Joint Committee on Finance and the Public Service examining the report prepared under the legislation. It is perfectly open to them and I do not understand why it is necessary to specify parliamentary procedures in a broader way in the legislation. It is equally open to both committees to retain expert advice, if they obtain the relevant sanctions from the Houses of the Oireachtas Commission to examine and evaluate such a report. I do not understand why it is essential to write it into the legislation. That trespasses on Parliament's prerogatives in the matter. It is a matter for both committees if they wish to evaluate the report to seek such assistance and to make such arrangements in that regard.

I refer to the issue of the scheme and individual agreements. The scheme will be submitted to the Houses of the Oireachtas and the individual agreements will be commercial in character and, therefore, confidential. I envisage considerable difficulties in furnishing them to the House. The scheme will outline the nature of the agreements that can be arrived at. Deputy Bruton asked for a citation of the amendment I propose to move in the Seanad. It provides that where the Minister proposes to make a scheme under section 6(4), "he or she shall cause a draft of the proposed scheme to be laid before each House of the Oireachtas and he or she shall not make the scheme unless and until a resolution approving of the draft has been passed by each such House". The scheme will be submitted to both Houses where resolutions will be tabled and approved. That was agreed during this debate. I intend to table that in the Seanad and if the House accepts the amendment, it will return to this House for consideration later.

Deputy Bruton is seeking to appoint someone to the risk assessment committee. I am satisfied the Minister has adequate powers to impose such conditions as he or she thinks fit on any financial support provided. I can require the recipient of financial support to allow an observer to sit on any of its committees as a precondition of availing of such support. The amendment provides that someone "shall" be appointed, which limits my flexibility under the legislation to do many things. How the lending practices of institutions that benefit from this guarantee from the State are managed is a core issue and it was referred to by many Deputies. It is essential we do not trammel in any way our powers to monitor this position or to appoint people to sit on or observe committees or access records. The scheme and the agreements completed on foot of it will be precise in this regard.

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