Mary Harney (Dublin Mid West, Progressive Democrats)

Mr. Tim O'Malley's letter was sent to me last night but has not appeared in the newspapers today. He must have sent it to the Deputies opposite. I do not agree with the letter — he is a pharmacist. Mr. O'Malley and I have never agreed on this issue. When the former Minister for Health and Children, Deputy Martin, removed the restriction in 2002 Mr. O'Malley used similar language to me. He also did so when the 2005 legislation was published. When one is involved as a professional one cannot be as objective as others. My responsibility is to ensure better value for money for patients and taxpayers and that we have a viable and vibrant pharmacy business.

Pharmacists are paid for the entire process. Their fees were €367 million last year and this will not change. It is €100,000 higher in terms of fees than in Northern Ireland, with the caveats I included earlier about different jurisdictions.

There is no change in the fees. Our contract with pharmacists concerns their fees. The Dorgan group will consider a flat fee for service. Of course pharmacists can argue and articulate the impact that changes will have on them. They can make their case to a group of fair-minded citizens who have available to them the expertise they need. We want to move away from a situation where the more expensive drugs are, the more it costs to dispense them. The mark-up and the discounts are not sustainable or fair and no fair-minded person could argue against that.

I cannot tell the Deputies that every pharmacist in the country will remain open. A pharmacy on Grafton Street, perhaps the busiest street in the country, closed last year. I cannot guarantee anyone's business, nor could any government. Pharmacists know how to run their businesses, I do not know how to run a pharmacy. I am very confident that, notwithstanding these changes, we will have a vibrant pharmacy sector. The major beneficiaries will be pharmacies heavily dependent on GMS, where there will be a fee of at least €5, increased from €3.26 at present. The other beneficiaries will be pharmacies in rural areas with small volumes. There is no doubt these pharmacies will gain, something that is important to me. I am confident that pharmacists on which medical card patients, sicker people, poorer people and older people are dependent will do better with a flat fee.

There will be losers. One cannot remove €100 million and not have losers — I am not a fool.

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