Martin Mansergh (Tipperary South, Fianna Fail)

If one had to choose between Judge Balthazar Garzon who put some Ministers engaged in the dirty war in Spain behind bars and is taking an equally tough line with ETA and Mr. Justice Lord Denning, give me Judge Balthazar Garzon any day.

I do not accept that the opt-out reflects any Euroscepticism. Is Deputy Flanagan saying the Fine Gael position is that if it were in government, it would end the opt-out immediately? If that is the case, his opposition would be worth hearing and analysing.

As the Minister complained, neutrality is an endlessly elastic piece of string. As Dr. Johnson said, there is a lot of ruin in a nation. Neutrality is almost like a toy in a baby's bath; when one knocks it over, it bounces up again. Somehow, neutrality always rises up again for the next debate on the next treaty. I do not credit any of our European partners with imperialist ambitions or believe any of them, under the auspices of the European Union, would want to get the Union involved in another Iraq. The fact is — this is never recognised by the critics who major on the subject — defence spending and armies have been reduced in recent years.

The European Union has had a tremendous and positive impact on Ireland. Our GNP per head has increased from approximately two thirds of the European average to well over the European average. Reference has been made to the progressive effect in the areas of labour law, the environment, women, agricultural policy, the euro, capital investment through the social funds and so on. We have never been as comfortably placed as a nation. We do not have to choose, as was sometimes the case, between European allies and Britain. We are partners with everybody in Europe and would need an overwhelming reason to oppose the European treaty ratification and effectively sideline ourselves. The European Union has enabled us to participate in the race to the top, not to the bottom. Opting out would deepen levels of poverty and exclusion.

I am not entirely surprised that Deputy Ó Snodaigh seemed to confuse the Council of Europe which is not meeting later this week and the European Council. The European Union is probably one of the most open and transparent international organisations. I was amused to hear him talk about fears of harmonising taxes. Was it not Sinn Féin earlier this year which wanted us to harmonise our corporation tax rate with that in Northern Ireland and raise it to about 18%? I suppose we must be grateful that there are people who will provide us with debate as we come to a decision on the matter but the case against the reform treaty has no credibility. It is an important decision that we must take. Our EU membership has served us extremely well.

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