Michael Ring (Mayo, Fine Gael)

We got the biscuits but we never got the factory. Similarly, the Land Registry has been coming to Roscommon for a long time. While I am not confident, I hope it is a part of decentralisation that will happen soon.

I am glad the Minister is at last reforming the Land Registry. The people are paying for the service through stamp duty and direct taxation but when they want to obtain title deeds or get their property registered and there is a problem, they may have to wait up to four years as the Land Registry has a long waiting list. The staff of the Land Registry do an excellent job in difficult circumstances. There is no point establishing a new agency if we do not intend to provide the necessary resources and staff. What happens in the Land Registry is a disgrace. I do not know how the staff have tolerated it and why they have not gone on strike. They work under terrible conditions, which is not right. I am glad the Minister is reforming the office as it is time to do so.

People and their property must be protected. They must know when they register their title that it is for life. A constituent of mine had a right of way through her property. When she planned to do some building on her property, she checked and found that a certain person — I must be careful what I say in this regard — had registered the property and taken away the right of way. I told my constituent to go to her solicitor and that she should put the matter in writing immediately. An investigation took place but nobody knows to this day who registered the property. My constituent had it re-registered in her name, for which I am glad, but the problem should not have arisen. I will make no further comment on the matter except to say that a layman could not have done what was done. The Minister can read between the lines. However, my constituent won her case and got her property back, although the case may yet take a further step. The Land Registry found that the property had been re-registered, although it could not find out who had done so. I hope that whatever equipment is installed as part of the current reform will ensure that such an incident can never occur again.

Great difficulty has arisen in getting local authority affordable housing property registered. It is time action was taken in this regard. Residents are entering into contracts and agreements with local authorities but the process is being held up because the property is not registered in the Land Registry. This should be dealt with more quickly so that residents do not have to wait.

This reminds me of the situation when local authorities began selling local authority houses. When a local authority house is to be sold, a valuation is made of the property and the tenants are offered the opportunity to buy. In the Mayo County Council area, if that offer is not taken up within six months, the house is revalued. Last year, a couple in my area had their house valued and agreed to buy. However, their solicitor found that the local authority had not registered the property with the Land Registry and the deal could not proceed. After approximately nine months had elapsed, the property had to be revalued by the local auctioneer, who increased the price by 37%. This problem is now to be dealt with in that there will be an independent valuation authority to deal with such cases. However, my point is that if the local authority had done its work in the first instance by registering the property, the problem would not have arisen.

The deeds for many properties came from the Land Commission. I do not understand why one Government agency cannot pass information to another. If a person is looking for a land certificate from the Land Commission, it can take five or six years to get it from the Department of Agriculture and Food, which should not be the case. The people involved are citizens who pay their taxes. They are looking for what is theirs, yet they must wait for the information to be passed from one agency to another. It is not good enough.

The staff of the Land Registry have worked in very difficult circumstances. If a problem arises, they try to deal with it, especially in sad circumstances.

When the new agency is established, will it be accountable to the Dáil? Will Deputies be able to table questions on the new agency or will it be like the National Roads Authority or the Health Service Executive in that we will table questions and the Minister will reply that he has no responsibility in the matter? This will result in nobody's business being nobody's business. The matter will be taken out of politicians' hands but they will take the blame when their constituents come to them looking for answers. We will not be able to call those responsible to account even though the people elected us to represent them in this House and bring forward legislation.

I hope something will be put in place to allow Members to table questions about problems with the Land Registry without them being ruled out of order by the Ceann Comhairle or Leas-Cheann Comhairle on the basis that the Minister is not responsible for the matter. The Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform is responsible for this matter. The Land Registry should be under the control of the Houses of the Oireachtas or, at the very least, Members should be permitted to table questions. Powers should not be taken away from Members in respect of this issue. Members can at least table questions at present and receive answers. They can put pressure on the Department of Agriculture and Food to hand over its documentation to the Land Registry if it must be handed over. If we did not have this facility, it would be catastrophic for the people.

The time has come for us to modernise the Land Registry to ensure that it does not take two or three years for the sale of a house to be registered. It should be carried out quickly. Currently, solicitors blame the Land Registry while the Land Registry blames the solicitors, but it is the person buying the house who feels the pressure. These people who are frustrated with the Land Registry and solicitors have only the politicians to whom to turn to sort out their problems. The process should be more open. Solicitors should be forthcoming about the date they send details to the Land Registry and the dealing number. The Land Registry should confirm when it receives the documentation and issue a date for the processing of the case.

Unfortunately, it is akin to the national lottery at present. Documentation is sent to the Land Registry with no guarantee when it will be dealt with. A buyer can get the sale registered quickly or he or she could wait years for it to be registered. In my former career as an auctioneer, I dreaded hearing that a problem with title had arisen with a property whose sale I was handling. I knew that I would not complete the deal and would not be paid for two or three years because problems would arise when it was sent to the Land Registry.

We should modernise the Land Registry but we should give it the resources, staff and equipment it needs. I hope this Bill will not lead to the matter being dispensed with so that politicians will no longer be able to table questions in the Dáil in respect of the registry. I want to put on the record that people are frustrated with the public service. If the Minister of State rings any Health Service Executive area tomorrow morning looking for information, he will find that the newest member of staff in every HSE area is the message minder. The same scenario arises in county councils and Government agencies. It will probably be the last time the Minister of State hears from anyone in that HSE area.

I rang the Department of Social and Family Affairs and discovered that any caller would need a degree in using a telephone to get through to the person to whom he or she wanted to talk. A caller is first given a number. He or she rings that number, is asked for a particular number and is then transferred to another line. The same situation arises with county councils. It is not possible to contact a member of staff. One's call is diverted——

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