Michael McDowell (Dublin South East, Progressive Democrats)

There are circumstances in which the commission can conduct retrospective inquiries under the Garda Síochána Act. I have been trying to get the various inquiries up and running in a timely fashion.

I am glad every Deputy has broadly welcomed the fact that a commission of investigation is being established in this matter. While I have been criticised for the time taken to establish the commission, this was not an option until late 2004 because the Act was not in operation until that time. Deputies should also bear in mind that a live Garda investigation was taking place on the case. When a number of Deputies repeatedly raised the matter, I asked the Garda Commissioner for a full report and full chronology of events. I received the report in April.

When I indicated in public that I intended to proceed with a commission of investigation I had to go through the relevant steps, namely, to bring the proposition to Government, secure Government approval, identify a person to chair the inquiry and chart out its terms of reference. All of this took place after Shane Murphy SC, to whom I am deeply indebted, undertook a study of the matter and made a recommendation that a commission of investigation be established as the appropriate means of inquiry. It is not as if nothing has been happening. I have been carefully putting together the basis for this inquiry. I agree, however, that if I had the commissions of investigation legislation available to me a couple of years ago, I could have addressed the issue earlier and in a context other than the establishment of a full tribunal of inquiry. That was the dilemma in which I found myself.

I do not wish to discuss the substance of the inquiry as it is a matter for Mr. Birmingham SC to conduct the inquiry. Serious issues are involved, however. The fact that two people could confess to the same crime is a serious state of affairs. Nobody, least of all me, seeks to minimise or avoid this fact. Nevertheless, it will be worthwhile to await Mr. Birmingham's report. Without trespassing on what Shane Murphy SC examined and stated in his report, this case is more complex than Deputies might imagine. No allegation of physical abuse was made and the issues arising were the state of mind of the person in detention and suggestibility. The crunch issue is whether suggestions were made to Mr. Lyons which should not have been made. It is not the case, however, that someone fabricated a complete statement or conjured it up from nowhere. The word "frame" has been abused and is not an apt description of what took place in this case. Nonetheless, it is a serious matter if a person agrees to confess to a crime he or she did not commit. This should not happen in any circumstances.

Other cases in which people have died in Garda custody were raised. It will be the function of the ombudsman commission to investigate all such cases. Under the new Garda Síochána Act, members of the commission will be required to carry out such investigations themselves and will not be in a position to delegate responsibility for them to the Garda Síochána.

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