Jim O'Keeffe (Cork South West, Fine Gael)

I support the proposal to establish a commission of investigation. I do not wish to comment in detail on the amendment proposed by my Labour Party colleague, Deputy Costello, except that it appears to improve the terms of the motion. This will be dealt with in more detail by Deputy Costello and the leader of the Labour Party.

It is quite clear that the actions perpetrated against Dean Lyons by our justice system were not just extremely worrying and regrettable, but thoroughly unacceptable in a State which claims to administer the rule of law and the principles of natural justice. It raises very serious questions and I am glad these are being addressed at long last. The questions raised relate to conduct of the Garda in dealing with Dean Lyons at the time, its investigation of the matter and in particular the taking of a statement which ended up as inculpatory evidence. Questions on the general standards by which we treat vulnerable people in custody are also raised. In a way I have a sense of déjÀ vu. I recall in the early days of my career in the Dáil the Ó Briain report on issues that were somewhat similar, with the report being published by the then Circuit Court president, Barra Ó Briain.

Before we delve into the issue of investigation we should place on record that we as legislators dealing with the rule of law regret what happened to this unfortunate young man. He was one of many young Irish people who had fallen through the cracks of disadvantage and disaffection. There is a general obligation on us as legislators and public representatives to address the broader issues, and to ensure that fewer people fall through those cracks, aiming for a future where there are no such cracks. We should aim for a future where all young people can be given equal opportunities before the law and be equal in society. Equality before the law is a very important principle that we must espouse.

The first point occurring to me in speaking today is why this process has taken so long. We must examine our consciences, as well as our practices and procedures, in dealing with this issue. The terrible deaths of Mary Callinan and Sylvia Shiels occurred in March 1997, which is over eight years ago. The arrest of Dean Lyons occurred not long after this, and it became apparent relatively early that he could not have been responsible for the crime to which he had confessed. We have a case to answer as to why it took so long to have the case dealt with and properly investigated. It took the Garda Síochána until last February to issue an apology on the matter.

The people who emerged well from this matter were the relations of the deceased. I was impressed with the statement of Stella Nolan, the sister of one of the deceased, after the apology. She stated she was glad that the Garda had apologised to the family but that many questions were still to be answered regarding why Lyons was charged, put in prison and then released. She stated in a dignified manner that she was not looking for revenge, but justice. This was a fair way of putting her case, as she had been traumatised by the events.

The reaction at the time of the parents of Dean Lyons was very dignified. They stated that although they knew all along that their son did not commit the murders, they believed he was vulnerable and strung out when he made the admission of guilt. They fairly stated that Lyons had a hand in it when he admitted guilt to the Garda. However, the parents pointed out they were not angry or bitter, and in a dignified way they stated that the Garda had a job to do, and when it emerged that a mistake was made, it was admitted. This was a fair reaction on the part of the family of Dean Lyons at the time. This does not take away from the point that it has taken eight years to have a commission of investigation set up on the issue.

What occurred at Grangegorman was undoubtedly an horrific and sickening tragedy that shocked the nation to its core in 1997. The manner in which these unfortunate women were murdered was particularly brutal. The Garda were under much pressure to catch and detain the person responsible for such depravity. However, there can be no excuse for the events which transpired in an ostensible effort to take the killer off the streets. There is no explanation so far as to why it came about that an innocent homeless person who happened to be sleeping in the general vicinity was blamed. He clearly was a vulnerable person and must have been susceptible to manipulation by people in a position of power. There is no explanation as to why this led to a confession of guilt to murder which clearly did not stand up to scrutiny.

No matter the pressures on the Garda Síochána, there are certain pressures that should be resisted. It is not a question of responding to pressure or securing convictions, but of maintaining the rule of law at all times. This must be a basic facet of the approach of gardaí at all times. Unfortunately, one of the outcomes was that the arrest of Dean Lyons on 25 July and his detention in custody meant that the pressure to find the true killer eased. This is an issue I would like further clarified. It is important in the context that a forensic psychiatrist assisting the Garda in the investigation of the Grangegorman murders warned that the killer could strike again. This is of particular concern because Dean Lyons, having apparently been manipulated or coerced into making a confession, was arrested, resulting in the easing off of the murder probe. However, shortly afterwards, on 16 August, while Dean Lyons was still in Mountjoy Prison, a young Roscommon couple were stabbed to death in a similarly brutal fashion to the unfortunate ladies murdered in Grangegorman.

Perhaps there is evidence that this was the second strike of the killer about which the forensic pathologist had warned the Garda. It raises a question as to whether those murders might have been preventable if there had not been an alleged confession in the first case and an easing off of the murder investigation at that stage. The man who killed the Doyles was quickly arrested by gardaí. It was this same person who made four separate voluntary admissions to the Grangegorman murders, although I accept that those admissions have since been withdrawn. Serious issues arise as to whether the Roscommon couple might have been saved from their gruesome fate if the murder investigation had continued.

A further issue which must be addressed is that Dean Lyons remained in prison for seven months before the murder charges against him were withdrawn. Questions arise as to why it took so long to release a clearly innocent man from prison and the fact that no formal charges have been brought against anybody arising from the Grangegorman murders.

The case of Dean Lyons, allied to the revelations from the Morris tribunal, clearly establish that there must be a process whereby such issues can be brought to light, fully exposed and dealt with within a reasonable period. Serious questions must be asked and answered. I am glad that at long last that process is under way in this case.

A number of issues arise with regard to the approach adopted by the Minister towards the commission of investigation. I had hoped the Minister might be in a position to give a more detailed estimate of the costs he expects will arise in connection with the establishment of the commission of investigation. He referred to a figure of €500,000, but this only covers the salaries, fees and administrative costs of the commission for the first four months of operation and does not include any third party costs that might be awarded by the commission. I had hoped the Minister would have a more complete ballpark estimate with regard to time and cost, which are obviously issues in which the public is interested. While I appreciate it is not possible to give exact figures at this stage, it would be helpful to be certain of the time and cost involved.

There is genuine public concern in regard to tribunals generally, which can seem like runaway, out of control engines. This issue was discussed previously, in particular in the context of the Commissions of Investigation Act. There is a shared view in the House that this type of approach cannot continue. The establishment of this commission is the first example of an investigation under the new Act. We want to make absolutely sure that a proper precedent is set with regard to time and cost considerations.

This leads me to the question of the terms of reference. I take the Minister's point as to why one of the recommendations of Mr. Shane Murphy SC is not being taken on board by him. I am concerned that any recommendation from an independent report should be given proper consideration. The Minister has proposed an approach which will ensure that the issue raised by Mr. Murphy SC will be considered, for which I am glad. On balance, I agree with the approach proposed by the Minister in dealing with that aspect of the matter, namely, there will be a general report from the expert group examining the broader issues, which will be published.

I support the establishment of the commission. I am concerned that it took so long to achieve this but, at this stage, we should get it under way and give the necessary authority to the commissioner to begin his work.

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