Liam Twomey (Wexford, Fine Gael)

We need to discover the terms of that insurance agreement. How much information did the diocese disclose to the insurance company? The real Ferns Report may now lie in what was disclosed to the insurance company. This is an important point which the Minister should pursue.

The issue of child sexual abuse in Ireland moved from one spoken of behind closed doors out into the open in the 1990s, which coincided with the time when the power of the church was weakening. I am sure Deputy Howlin will agree that 15 years later many people find it very difficult to face up to the issue of child sexual abuse, which is our experience on the ground in County Wexford even today. People still do not want to talk about the issues exposed in this report. We need to look back to the 1990s to consider what brought the issue into the open and to learn from that period.

While it had nothing to do with clerics, the Kilkenny incest case sticks out in my mind as a pivotal point when we exposed the horrors of child sexual abuse in our society. The McColgan case in the north west came to light in 1995. The horrors of the Goldenbridge orphanage were exposed in the 1990s. We had the cases of Fr. Brendan Smyth and Fr. Payne which gave undeniable proof, if it were needed, that child sexual abuse was present in our society and that we were doing little about it.

I often wonder why more than 100 cases have come to light in the diocese of Ferns warranting a separate report. The archdiocese of Dublin will be subject to the same kind of review. However, we need to look at what happened throughout the country. I do not believe that County Wexford and the archdiocese of Dublin were the only two hotspots for this kind of terrible abuse. We should try to explore why this came to light in Ferns. Perhaps it had something to do with the Kilkenny incest case, following which a report was issued and recommendations made, which were clearly followed up by the South Eastern Health Board at the time. The recommendations covered the following: how to report child abuse; holding case conferences; interagency co-operation between the Garda and schools; recording of information; prevention and family liaison supports; and counselling for victims of abuse. Things changed in the south east in the 1990s. While the Kilkenny incest case was not the only factor, it was important.

There was the hard work of brave individuals who came out and spoke, including many who had been victims of abuse. It was highly significant that some of the victims came forward and made themselves known. They put their names in the media and broke the stigma. Many of these people have led terrible lives because they carried a stigma and feel they continue to be the victims. In some respects they may feel they were wrong. We need to give great credit to people like Colm O'Gorman who came forward and exposed what was going on. If those people had not come forward we might never have had the Ferns Report.

When discussing this matter we should be careful not to engage in a witch-hunt. Nobody wants a repeat of what happened in Cleveland in Britain in the 1980s, which was a disaster for the families involved. Two doctors made allegations that children were being abused and many children were taken from their parents and placed in care. The parents had to fight for many years to have their children returned from care and it was eventually proved that no abuse had been carried out. The over-zealousness of the two doctors resulted in children wrongfully being taken from their parents. However, we also need to face up to child sexual abuse in our society and challenge it in a serious way. In 20 years' time a report into what we do now may be published, just as people look back to what we should have done between 1985 and 1990 and what happened in the 1990s.

Some good things have happened, including protection for those who report child abuse to protect them from being sued by the abusers, who can be very manipulative and well able to get their own way. I welcome the report's recommendation that the non-reporting of a crime become a crime in itself, which might change behaviour. If we cannot do so in a nice way we should use the iron fist of the law to change the behaviour of those with responsibility, including bishops and school principals. We need to invest more in child protection. The Minister of State referred to the Garda vetting unit. We must not forget those doing fantastic work for voluntary groups, both within the church and outside it. They must not be forgotten. I hope that my colleague, Deputy Enright, will speak more about a policy she published a year ago on the matter of vetting and protecting children in our society.

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