David Stanton (Cork East, Fine Gael)

Perhaps. Proper road signs are needed to ensure that people such as tourists do not get lost. It can be frustrating to get lost and it can cause people to get very angry. When I stopped at a garage when I was lost, they had three sets of maps on the counter because they were so used to people calling in such circumstances. They had prepared photocopies of the relevant maps to give to people, depending on where they were going. Signposting needs to be clear. I ask the Minister of State to initiate a signposting policy throughout the country to ensure this area is dealt with properly. Signposts should be placed well in advance of the relevant junctions, not just at the junctions in question. It is not right that one should have to swerve at a junction because it was not signposted in advance. Perhaps we need somebody to examine this matter at national level. Each local authority seems to have a different policy in this regard. Local engineers do not seem to be sure whether to put up signposts. I ask the Minister of State to initiate a national signposting group to examine this matter and to take action, rather than simply placing a policy document on the Minister's desk.

The Bill also relates to the penalty points system. I remember when I was driving to Cork on the first morning of the system's operation, it was noticeable that every car on the road was crawling along just under the 60 mph limit.

Now when travelling at 60 mph on a dual carriageway, some fellow behind will flash his lights to encourage more speed. Obviously the fear factor disappeared very quickly. Colleagues on all sides have said that where there is a 40 mph limit gardaí spend a great deal of their time trying to catch people doing 43 mph or 44 mph, and the same approach is adopted to the 30 mph limit. That annoyed many people.

The Minister, who has great imagination, might be interested in a suggestion I came across. Instead of giving someone a penalty point, he might consider asking him or her to take an advanced driving course. One could offer the choice of accepting penalty points, or attending such a course. If a person chose the second route, he or she would have to complete an advanced driving course, paying for it themselves, and learn how to drive properly. I spoke last week to a commercial driver who spent most of his time on the road. His company did a very positive thing: it insisted that he complete such a course. I understand that the company that took him through it came in from the UK. He had been driving for many years and considered himself a good and careful driver. However, having completed the course, he realised that he had not known how to drive properly at all; he had not had a clue. He said that his eyes had been opened to the dangers, the risks and the need for caution. The Minister might wish to take that suggestion on board if he introduces legislation to consolidate matters. It is the system in countries including America, where they call them traffic violator schools. That might be worth looking at here.

I am confused at the references to "built-up areas". Areas such as small villages are built up but are not specified in the Bill. Nowadays we have ribbon development, and in many parts of the country there are houses along the roadside. It has happened over the years, and those houses are now a fact, but we have not planned for roads to be widened or for footpaths to be constructed, with the result that, if children have to go from one house to another, they must walk or cycle along a very busy, narrow road. We must consider whether these areas too are built-up areas.

I note that the Minister has decided that those under the age of 16 should not be supplied with a mechanically propelled vehicle. I agree, but I have not seen the definition of such a vehicle or of "supply". Does it mean that a person may not drive the vehicle on the road? May he or she drive it on a field, or is the person banned from being in charge of such a vehicle in all circumstances? Does the term include golf buggies and lawn mowers? Does it mean that one may not drive, own or be supplied with a car as a gift or even in a will? Someone asked me what would happen if a grandfather willed a 12 year old his vintage Morris Minor. Could that happen?

The concern is small but real. If such things as golf buggies and lawn mowers are mechanically propelled, may a 15 year old cut the grass in his own garden, or does the Bill apply only to the roadway? If he may cut the grass in his own garden on a mechanically propelled vehicle, may he drive a car in his own garden?

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