Seymour Crawford (Cavan-Monaghan, Fine Gael)

I welcome the opportunity to say a few words on this important Bill. I am interested in the Minister's speech and how he claimed he did not want to go back into history. He then spent time doing that and questioned the right of Opposition colleagues to make any comments or raise any questions. The only issue my party raised was the timing of the referendum and we do not apologise for that. There is no need to criticise my party in raising issues. In general, we went along with it because we saw that there were problems. The Bill provides a legislative framework for the decision of the people of Ireland in last June's referendum. That is what it is all about.

The Minister suggested in his speech that if Fine Gael was working with others to provide leadership, it would not have handled the situation well. It seems the Minister thinks there are no problems because he is so brilliant. I would like him to say that to a lady who lives 500 yards from the hospital in Monaghan town. Is he prepared to suggest that her rights as an Irish citizen were looked after by this supposedly competent Government? No ambulance was available to go 500 yards up the road. We have to deal with competency rather than criticise everybody for the sake of criticising them. I feel very sore that the Minister has suggested that nobody other than members of his party and possibly the other Government party can do anything.

I recall that Deputies representing the main Government party were elected to the House after they tried to raise the heat on foreigners, or non-nationals, living in Cork and similar places. It was unreal, especially when one considers that thousands of Irish people went abroad in the past. We have all worked to try to improve this country. We should thank God that rather than have to leave in such large numbers, people are keen to come to Ireland. We should not forget the millions of Irish people who live abroad because their only choice was to leave. I have visited the places where they went in Canada, the US, England and elsewhere after they left this country. They were given the opportunity to work in such places, albeit in difficult circumstances, but at least they were allowed to do that. Many of those who did well abroad returned to Ireland to say how well they got on, but many others never reached the shores of the places to which they were going because they died on the way, or lived in absolute poverty in other countries. We cannot forget such things very easily.

As I said at the outset, Fine Gael generally supports the Minister's ideas in this regard. It accepts the need to ensure that the potential for the abuse of our citizenship laws is dealt with in a sensitive way. It is convinced that the Minister is introducing the Bill for all the right reasons. He can be assured of the support of Fine Gael Members. It would have been logical, however, to have brought this proposal before an all-party committee to try to reach consensus on the best possible policy. The House establishes internal committees, rather than external quangos, to deal with such matters. I was informed today that the Minister for Health and Children spent €30 million on external quangos to deal with matters which should have been considered by the House.

Fine Gael's only source of opposition to the Bill relates to the time limit provisions, but I would like to discuss a number of other issues. There is no coherent policy to deal with people coming into this country. As somebody who represents a constituency in which many low-paid jobs are filled by non-nationals, I constantly have to deal with delicate family problems. Unlike the previous speaker, I will not speak about individual cases. I have to deal with the Department of Enterprise, Trade and Employment to get work permits and with the Department of Justice, Equality and Law Reform on matters relating to family members. One sometimes does not know where one is going because it is very difficult to get direct telephone lines to Departments. My colleague, Deputy Jim O'Keeffe, has asked for direct telephone lines, similar to those available to Deputies when dealing with social welfare and other matters, to help us to get concise answers for those who contact us on behalf of their families.

A foreigner came to see me in my office yesterday. It can be difficult at times to understand their language. One can spend over an hour dealing with a family's needs. If I encounter great difficulties in getting answers at departmental level, what difficulties must be faced by those who try to address such matters themselves? The lady in question has been given great service in the medical field. If we are to bring people in to give services to them, we must ensure that they are looked after properly. If one wishes to ensure that nobody is sent out of this country without having enjoyed due process, it can be complex because one may have to deal with the Departments of Enterprise, Trade and Employment and Foreign Affairs, the authorities dealing with residency issues and the Garda Síochána. I would like a structure to be put in place to give Members of the Oireachtas, or the public, the right to access their entitlements.

I am aware of the Minister's attitude to children who were born in Ireland before the legal case and the referendum. We have to be somewhat reasonable in this regard. People may have come to this country for the wrong reasons, but many others were advised to come here. They may have paid money because they believed the only way to solve their problems was to come to this country. We are in the process of closing off the relevant legal loophole.

I am sure the Minister has been contacted by church leaders and others to discuss this issue, just as I have been. There is a need for understanding and leniency in that regard. The new circumstances which will be in place after this Bill has been passed, as I believe it will be, will have to be publicised and people will have to abide by them. Certain arrangements will have to be made for those who are caught in the interim. That we are still looking for people to come to this country to fill the jobs which are vacant gives us an opportunity in that regard. Some people would say that the relevant number is 9,000, while others would say that it is 11,000, but it is finite at this stage. Surely we can try to cope with that as best we can.

Many people continue to come to this country following the enlargement of the EU. We were freely taking people from Africa and other places before 1 May, but such people now face great difficulties when they try to extend or renew their work permits. I recently encountered the case of a person from Bulgaria, which hopes to join the EU soon. The person in question, who has waited for months for her situation to be clarified, has not been given any indication of when her case will be dealt with. She has been a good citizen, in the real sense of the word, because she has worked and paid taxes in this country, but she is finding it hard to get answers.

I know of a company which has employed many drivers from South Africa and east European countries such as Lithuania. The South African drivers can speak the English language and can drive on the same side of the road as us. When they end up in Belfast or London, they know exactly what they are doing. We all know that many accidents have been caused by drivers with a lack of knowledge of the roads. Some Lithuanians create problems in that regard. We need to show some common sense if we want to keep our country moving. Lorry drivers in the constituency I represent, Cavan-Monaghan, have a different context from their colleagues in Dublin, who may encounter trains and trams. The Minister might not appreciate that this is such an important matter. His party leader did not think there was any need for jobs in County Monaghan, but that is another day's work. We hope that her replacement as Minister for Enterprise, Trade and Employment will show us some sympathy.

I wish to touch on the issue of children born outside the country who are Irish citizens. I return to my first comment concerning Monaghan General Hospital. We have a major problem in that a good few children are born on the road between Clones and Wattlebridge in County Cavan. It is quite difficult to designate exactly what country they have been born in, the South or the North. From that point of view, I certainly welcome that we have an all-Ireland passport. At least they are sure of having one of them. It is rather funny for those of us not involved in the situation, but not for the poor parents.

The Bill closes off the issue of passports for sale. As one who knew of companies which benefited from the scheme, I must say that it served a purpose in difficult times. Unfortunately, like many initiatives of that nature, it was very much abused. In closing off a loophole, we should not close off the idea that we continue to investigate those who abused the system. People should not be let off with such abuse. A company in my county not far from the Louth border provided an extra ten years' good employment for many people as a result of that structure. Another company in Monaghan got off the ground, is now run by another firm, provides 70 jobs and will certainly expand. The scheme served a purpose, but it has outlived it, and I welcome its being closed off.

That brings me to another area of citizenship whereby people can spend only half the year outside the country and retain all the tax benefits of an exile. In recent weeks we have seen this type of behaviour with abuse of the tax code. We need to tie up that element of abuse as well. If someone wishes to retain Irish citizenship, he or she should pay tax.

Those are the main issues that I wished to raise on this Bill. As I said, in principle, we have no problems with its outline and purpose, but it is important that those who find themselves in limbo are sorted out in an amicable and reasonable way without undue pressure being brought to bear on them. Above all, someone who is willing to work should be allowed to do so. There is a group of people in the country, perhaps a great deal smaller than previously, who are on the dole or some sort of benefit because they simply do not want to work. I heard of a case not long ago of someone who did very good service at a fairly senior level in a meat company, but because her permit ran out, she had to decide to go into one of the encampments to wait and see how her legal situation would develop. That is wrong. That girl was willing to work, provide a badly needed service to the company, pay her taxes and abide by whatever decisions were ultimately made. However, if she had to go back, it would be with a very poor review. Since her permit ran out, she had to enter one of those encampments with people who did not share her ideas and might not necessarily wish to work in the same way. Then others in social welfare accuse her of haemorrhaging money from the State. She does not want to abuse the State but to get out to work. I support the Bill.

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