Jennifer Carroll MacNeill (Dún Laoghaire, Fine Gael)

Yes. That is exactly it. I have spoken to Mr. Gloster and Ms Hoey about that directly and that is exactly what I would like to have as a model. They are looking at different models for that. For example, if you were HSE staff and you would like to do extra hours, you should be able to apply on a digital system within the HSE that never, ever interacts with a private third party in any way. You can get your additional hours and be paid for that; that is fine. I think there will always be an element of private agency for people, we accept that, but there is a body of people who could do additional hours already within the HSE.

So what are we doing? I should be able to come and tell the Deputy much better than I am telling her today. I should be able to tell her exactly where the agency distribution is, what the conversion pathways are, how many different panels there are and what are the delays. I am not comfortable with where it is. I do see more activity regionally, I have to say. I am seeing better evidence at a regional level but I am not seeing it nationally yet. It is not good enough for me and I need to be able to come back and describe it to the Deputy better.