Mr. Gerard Smith:

What we see across the different centres goes back to Dr. Murray's point on industry understanding what it requires and then going to the right place to get that answer. It is a bit like Senator Paul Daly's question in that if one company wants this and wants an apprenticeship, apprenticeship may not be the right answer. We are working across different delivery provisions, such as traineeships or skills, to advance. In respect of truly understanding the problem we are trying to solve and coming up with the correct product we should be delivering to the industry, geography or region we are trying to serve, the mix in the Dublin commuter belt takes in the bio industry, the medical industry, science and engineering, the traditional SME and the sole trader with one apprentice in the welding trade. It is about being able to navigate that and know where that point is. What is the problem they are trying to solve? How best do we leverage the other aspects of the ETB and use them across? We should not think in a siloed way about how we measure a reward based on a certain number and, therefore, that is how we want to solve it because we get measured on it. If we go down that route, we lose perspective on what we are trying to solve in terms of the learner. That brings difficulties. It is difficult to be all things to all people but having collaboration, having industry at the centre and having that dialogue really keep a focus on what the right answer is to be.