Michael Healy-Rae (Kerry, Independent) | Oireachtas source

I thank the witnesses from IFAC. It is a breath of fresh air to hear a person say his knowledge is only partial and down to just fire doors, but I know Professor McMahon’s knowledge extends far beyond fire doors.

In addressing money matters, Oireachtas colleagues and I have been listening to lobbyists from all the various sectors, including today and yesterday, and we will do so again next week. We will be meeting representatives of various groups, including from the disability and hospitality sectors, and everybody will put forward the case for what they want in the budget. I, like all Members, having had a very extensive local election campaign, note that the one message that seems to be coming across an awful lot is that people want it to be more profitable to get up in the morning and go to work. At present, there are workers who ask whether they would be better off financially if they were not working at all. I am a great believer that, no matter what happens, everybody should get up in the morning and do a day’s work, of whatever type, but it is very disheartening for people who are just over the qualifying criteria for certain benefits, such as the medical card, the SUSI grant or assistance with building or buying a home. I am referring to all the various benefits that working sometimes debars you from qualifying for. It is not for me to tell political parties that aspire to be in government what to do, but I humbly suggest to everybody, including those in IFAC, that every one of us, including every elected Member of the Oireachtas, should be working together and asking what we can do to make Ireland a more friendly place for people to work in so they do not feel they are cutting off their noses to spite their faces by doing so.

At the moment, there is that big problem. There are people who are diligent, might have to run two cars and pay a mortgage but do not get assistance with the students they sent to third level, for example, who find themselves having just enough, but not having enough, at the same time, to do without these supports. They are really hurting without the supports. There are all these fancy words for them like the squeezed middle and different things. There is so much different terminology, you would not know what to make of half of it. The way I would put it in my plain ordinary language is that there are people who go to work and feel they hurt themselves by doing so. That is one issue.

I am always very interested in hearing what Deputy Boyd Barrett says because sometimes, in my humble opinion, he makes great sense and other times I am left scratching my head. He knows that and we get on very well. I am sure he would say the same thing about me. Regarding the knocking of buildings and rebuilding them, I see it every day outside on the road. A great friend of mine worked with me for many years driving a digger. He used to say, "Sure, Mike, it is all job creation and work creation." You can be on about the carbon effect of knocking them down and building them up but somebody will make money out of that process. It will create work, which is welcome, and there are plenty of men who put on helmets and boots every day and will be doing so for a long time. They are happy enough with the decision to knock it all down and build it up again. Sometimes buildings have a sell-by date and, with the cost and practicalities of refurbishing them and jigging them around, it makes way more sense to erase the whole lot off the map, start from the ground up, build what you want and it is a future-proof building. Of course, there are other times, with the retrofitting grant and things like that, of which I am very supportive, when it is a fine thing to have a house in the countryside or in a town, let the majority of it, bring it back to life and do so with the Government's assistance. I warmly welcome the €50,000 and €70,000 grants. That is the building debate. Those are my main points. I wish to allow time for responses. I welcome the witnesses here today. I always appreciate hearing people's knowledge of their particular sectors. I thank the Leas-Chathaoirleach.