Pa Daly (Kerry, Sinn Fein) | Oireachtas source

That is okay. I will just ask a few questions then. I understand Deputy O'Callaghan's point about sending a strong message from the Oireachtas on knife crime. My only concern is how effective it is going to be. I have a couple of questions.

Does he know what percentage of cases are dealt with on indictment because usually when they are dealt with on indictment, there would be another charge such as assault, assault causing serious harm or manslaughter, as the Deputy mentioned? I remember how there were difficulties in that section 9(1) could not be used after the bail referendum because it only carried a sentence of 12 months in jail. I think this was increased in 2009. The Deputy referenced the figures for seizures relating to knife crime. There were 490 offences under section 9(1) in 2020 while in the following years the number increased, in that in the following year it was 532 and there were further increases to 591 and 625. The figure for this year to date is 205. Increasing the penalties does not seem to make any difference to the number of knives being seized or the number of offences that are taking place. That is my main concern about it.

The Deputy mentioned that there must be an educational component. Perhaps some sort of restorative justice scheme should be introduced as well because there are a lot of young males from working-class areas and other areas who are carrying knives. It seems the increase in the penalties has not had any effect. In fact, the statistics have got worse. What then will be the impact? I was unable to find the percentage of cases that go on indictment, which is really what we are talking about here. That is my concern about increasing penalties. It sounds good but whether it will be effective or not is another thing.