Mr. Walter Lacey:

Gabhaim buíochas leis an gCathaoirleach agus leis na Seanadóirí as an deis a thabhairt dom labhairt leis an Seanad inniu mar chuid de chomhairliúchán poiblí an tSeanaid ar thodhchaí an daonlathais áitiúil.

I fully support the comments of councillors John Keogh and Tony Fitzgerald. It is likely I may repeat some of them.

When I mention Carlow I do so in the context of all towns of a similar size and form of town councils. I served on Carlow town and county councils for 25 years up to 2014 when the town councils were abolished. I continued for another five years on Carlow County Council. I then retired from local politics in 2019. In 2014, I strongly opposed the abolition of town councils as I felt then, and to this day I still feel, that it was a poor decision by then Minister. Carlow UDC, or town council, served the people of Carlow from 1899 to 2014. That was 150 years of real local democracy.

When town councils were abolished, the area that was represented by Carlow Town Council was replaced by a municipal area that actually extended beyond the original town boundary, taking in nearby rural areas around the town. The new municipal area was allocated seven seats and this meant the new district, including Carlow town, which once had nine members, now had only seven representatives or 39% out of the 18 representatives for the entire county. Up to 2014, Carlow Town Council had its own sizeable budget consisting of rates and other charges coupled with Government grants. The nine members of Carlow Town Council were able to make decisions for their own area and within their own budget. Carlow lost its own identity as it was now the smaller percentage of the county as a whole but with over 50% of the population of the entire county.

I am very conscious of the duplication of representation on both Carlow town and county councils prior to 2014. There was a need for a reconfiguration process. In Carlow there were also six members of Carlow Town Council elected to Carlow County Council. I believe, however, that abolishing the town council was the easy option for the Minister to take. A further option could have been taken by going full time, as members said earlier, which was one possibility. My ask of this Seanad consultation process on the future of local democracy is to seriously consider the reinstatement of town councils, including the abolition of dual membership of councils as it was at the time. This was an unnecessary duplication.

I want to mention the quota systems. These form part of the overall electoral system. I have mixed feelings on introducing quota systems. I understand there is an effort to attract more female representation into politics. I believe there should be more women in politics. In Carlow at the moment, there are two female representatives out of 18. I have noticed there is an increase in female candidates for the upcoming elections in June. There are two trains of thought about a quota system. I find myself quoting two very strange bedfellows: Deputy Michael Healy-Rae and former Speaker of the House in Washington, Democrat Nancy Pelosi. Deputy Healy-Rae does not believe in having a quota system and feels it is insulting to women. When asked about a quota system, Former Speaker Nancy Pelosi recently said, "I don't want anybody to vote for me because I'm a woman. I don't want anybody to vote against me because I'm a woman.” For years now the political system by its nature has done nothing to encourage women into politics. If the Government does feel it necessary to introduce quotas in local democracy, then I call on the Government to enforce it within their own political parties. One of the current Government parties has three candidates in an upcoming local election in Carlow. All three candidates are men. It needs to be enforced.

I have one final comment. Reference has been made to the private sector and I raised this as an issue with previous Ministers. Provision is made for public and civil servants if they wish to contest local or national elections, and certainly for national elections. People in the farming community and business owners are in a position to make their own provisions if they wish to go into politics. Retired people, and indeed unemployed people, who are all entitled to seek election, have time on their side if they wish to enter politics. It is different, however, for people like me. I was an employee in the private sector and found it next to impossible to enter elected politics but for the generosity of the company I had worked with for 40 years. I want the committee to be conscious that the full-time role for councillors is probably the only option. Otherwise people in the private sector just cannot do it. For an elected TD, the person must leave his or her job, and if the Dáil falls in one or two years, then the person is out of a job and out of a seat as he or she may not get re-elected. A teacher, for example, would be able to go back to teaching.

Gabhaim buíochas leis an gCathaoirleach as an deis labhairt leis an gcoiste anseo inniu. Guímid gach rath ar na baill ina gcuid oibre.