Oireachtas Joint and Select Committees

Wednesday, 10 April 2024

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Education and Skills

Key Issues for the Department of Education: Minister for Education

Photo of Norma FoleyNorma Foley (Kerry, Fianna Fail) | Oireachtas source

I thank the Deputy. I will go to the SET question first. In terms of the consultation question, I want to say to the Deputy straight-up that there was 18 months of consultation here. The National Association of Principals and Deputy Principals, the Irish Primary Principals Network and the management bodies - all of the so-called "education partners" - were part of this process. They were absolutely represented. They were part of the process. It was discussed. It was analysed. People were engaged with and they were represented. Their representative bodies were part of this engagement process. To be fair, I can say from a national point of view that their national representatives issued a very positive statement for public release in relation to this system. It was professionals on the ground who brought the challenges of the 2017 system to the fore and said it was not working. Out of respect to that, they were engaged with over a long period of 18 months. It is not accurate to say they were not consulted. As I said, they positively welcomed it when it was announced.

We are very clear. As I said earlier, it will never be 100% for everybody in the system. For that reason, there is a new type of review in place. Heretofore, when the review was in place, it happened in the middle of the school year - Deputy Nolan would understand this well - and it was almost too late. Therefore, we announced the hours earlier so that people who they felt that they were not possibly being reflected could enter into the review system. We have said that the review will take place between March and May so that it will be fully in place by the end of this school year and the opening of the next school year. Some 67% will retain the exact same or they will increase, and 23% will have a reduction. In 70% of cases, that reduction will be less than five hours, and 90% of that will be due to the fact that their enrolment numbers have gone down. We have had a number of reviews. Over 200 reviews have taken place. More than 30 of those have already been gone through, and that is only in the past fortnight or so. At least 30 of those reviews have seen an increase in hours - everything from 2.5 hours up to something like 27.5 hours. Therefore, the system is working.

We are introducing this system in order to do it better. We are asking people to follow with us on the system. The other system was not perfect. We believe that this is a better system. I ask people to engage in the review process and let us see how we go. It will be kept under review. I gave that commitment as well. If people are saying it is still not working right, we will do better. There is a lot of confidence around this system putting at its heart the needs of children or young people with the most complex and challenging of needs.

The other thing I meant to say to the Deputy about the clusters is that we gave a very early announcement so that the clusters could be put in place. We also envisaged that there would be fewer clusters and less time travelling for teachers going from place to place, etc. The idea was that it would be a positive from that point of view as well.

I absolutely hear what Deputy Nolan is saying about bus drivers. I would say this is something that has been raised by everybody in this forum - the Deputy has a neighbour who has raised it consistently - including the Chair and Deputy Clarke. I have raised it. Bus Éireann tells me it continues to keep it under review, and that the current position reflects the view of the RSA. I understand that the office of the Minister, Deputy Eamon Ryan, will undertake a review of the issue around those who are aged 70 and over and we will see what will unfold there. Bus Éireann has said that it is keeping it under review but it defers to the RSA.

I absolutely understand where the Deputy is coming from with regard to the nearest schools, etc. One's nearest or next nearest school must be within 4.8 km or 3.2 km, respectively, at post-primary and primary levels. I know the challenges around that. It is envisaged that the school rule, in relation to the nearest school, will be dropped.

Where there is a route in place and where there are ten young people who need a service, we have to be clear that there would still have to be ten people to make the service viable.

I am missing one question. One was the special education teaching hours, one was bus drivers, and-----

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