Oireachtas Joint and Select Committees

Wednesday, 28 February 2024

Joint Oireachtas Committee on Social Protection

Energy Poverty: Discussion (Resumed)

Photo of Donnchadh Ó LaoghaireDonnchadh Ó Laoghaire (Cork South Central, Sinn Fein) | Oireachtas source

I will try to ask all of my questions at once. They are more for the Department of housing than for the Department of Social Protection.

I have a brief question for the Department of Social Protection to flag two issues. I can be critical of the Department, so it is good to give credit where it is due and I take this opportunity to do that. We had the Irish Cancer Society before us earlier and I had a recent case where the Department showed a fair bit of compassion to somebody with a terminal form of cancer. I commend Liam Daly in the control section on the compassionate approach taken. It is important to get that on record.

I will flag something, but do not necessarily need a response on it. I have tried on a number of occasions to raise the criteria for the warmer homes scheme with the SEAI and the Department of energy, as it is its responsibility. I understand the Department's objective to ensure those on the lowest incomes benefit from it. However, people on invalidity pension do not currently have access to the warmer homes scheme on the basis it is not a means-tested scheme. The Department of Social Protection officials would understand maybe better than the SEAI or the other Department that does not necessarily mean people on invalidity pension would not have the same income and that they would not qualify for a means test. Very often people on invalidity are on quite low incomes and would qualify for a means test, but have gone for the invalidity pension because it is easier to get if they have the stamps, or because the medical criteria are marginally different from disability. It is not the Department of Social Protection officials' decision to make, but in their discussions with the Department of energy and the SEAI, it is important that the warmer homes scheme be expanded to those on invalidity. This could perhaps be subject to some other test as well, like whether people qualify for a medical card or different things like that. It is important because these people are on quite low incomes.

The previous session involved the ICS and the organisation raised the issue of people with life-limiting forms of cancer and their ability to access automatically the household benefits. Is that something the Department has considered? Has it had discussions with the Irish Cancer Society?

Turning to the Department of housing, my constituency is an urban one and has a very large volume of social housing stock. A lot of good work has been done by Cork city and county councils over the past couple of years, but there is still a huge amount of work remaining and I am sure it is the case in all the major urban centres, especially. An awful lot of local authority housing is still in very poor condition. An awful lot of it is old, having been built in the 1940s and 1950s, and is challenging to retrofit. An issue that has been raised with me by contractors in particular is the money available through the local authorities is not as attractive as it was a couple of years ago. This is partly because there is more work, but partly because the amount being provided by the Departments through the local authorities is not keeping pace with construction inflation. Consequently, an awful lot of what is happening is work on the local authority apartment blocks where it is probably easier to achieve economies of scale. Work is not happening to the same extent as it was with the houses, many of which were, as I said, built in the 1940s and 1950s. Is the Department actively reviewing the amount being provided to local authorities, because it seems to have slowed to some extent?

I have something else to flag. It is a small bit parochial but I would be neglecting my duties otherwise and I am sure this is an issue in other areas. There is particular type of local authority flat that exists in Cork and may exist also in Dublin, which has a very substantial balcony at the stairwell that is really challenging to retrofit. The flats at Noonan's Road are probably the best-known example and have been the source of discussion. The chief executive of Cork City Council visited and said she could hardly believe the cold and damp conditions there. It is a priority for regeneration at the minute, but there are other examples of that model across the city in Togher, Ballymacthomas, off Shandon Street and Wolfe Tone Street, Cherry Tree Road and different places like that. This model might exist in other places. Is this an issue the Department is aware of? An awful lot of the straight-line apartment blocks, which are the lower-hanging fruit, have been addressed and some good work has been done. However, the model I have referred to seems to be very hard to retrofit because the surface are is big, there are a lot of big openings and there is this wide stairwell.

From a local authority point of view, a lot of housing stock, though very well-built at the time, has had time take a toll on it. Local authority houses built between the 1940s and 1960s are often cold and damp. In Dublin they are in places like Crumlin, Drimnagh, Kimmage and Ballyfermot. In Cork they are in places like Mount Sion Road, Greenmount and Ballyphehane. There might be a street of 50 houses and there might be 20 local authority houses left. They will be in twos and threes and that kind of stuff, but the rest will have been bought over the past 60 or 70 years. All the housing stock is probably in need of retrofitting, but only a percentage is the responsibility of the Department. Complicated though it may be, there may be an opportunity to marry the interests of the private owners and maybe some small number of landlords as well and those of the residents of the local authority stock, which is reduced but still very substantial in these areas. Is the way to achieve those economies of scale something the Department has considered? The windows and doors of an awful lot of these houses might have been done, but the walls and the roofs are still leaking a lot of heat and letting in damp as well. That is the height of it.

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