Fiona O'Loughlin (Fianna Fail) | Oireachtas source

I thank the four witnesses. They have given us valuable insights and thoughts into what is an increasingly complex situation that we are tasked with looking at and making recommendations on in the report.

Something that struck me this morning was the thought that we should have ethics versus facts or research. I do not think it is a binary choice between the two. In contemplating all the different testimonies we have heard, we are tasked with trying to understand both. Ethics and values certainly have a place, as does evidence, research and lived experience.

That is the crux of what we have tried to do over the past number of months.

I have a few questions for the witnesses. I am particularly interested in what Professor Preston said about the impact on families. We have heard from families. It is interesting to hear her perspective, in particular the issue of secrecy and how that impacted on families and how we could try to make things better. We must consider whether there could be an open and transparent system, with the necessary safeguards. Does Professor Preston think that would be easier on families? People would not feel they have to have a secret plan in place. I can imagine it could lead to a lot of tensions within families when one or two family members know what is happening and others do not. That could lead to a difficult split afterwards.

Professor Preston referred to removing assisted dying from the health system in order to help health professionals. That would go against what other witnesses have said about having doctors who know patients very well. If we had a firm system of conscientious objection and were such a system to come into place in Ireland, does Professor Preston feel that would achieve the same goals?

I want to ask Professor White about the research he spoke about. It is the first time I have heard about some of the safeguards in place in some of the different assisted dying systems leading to difficulties with patients accessing the service. I would be of the view that if we were to introduce a system of dying in Ireland we would need to have very strict safeguards and criteria around that. I would be interested in hearing him elaborate on the type of safeguards that are causing these delays or patients being unable to access services if something is in place.

Professor MacLeod spoke about his concerns of abuse, concerns we all have. He also referred to the importance of palliative care and noted that there is not enough education around it among the medical profession or families. That is concerning, as somebody who has seen palliative care in use. It is a terrific system and those who administer palliative care are wonderful people and give great solace. I refer to the Danish national council on ethics. Professor MacLeod made interesting points in the conclusions he has come to. The general conclusion was not the overall conclusion, but it was found that issues of consent and access cannot be regulated in a satisfactory manner, something which is an area of concern. If we go down this road, they are the areas we would want to see safeguarding cover.