Mr. Fergal Mulligan:

That is in good hands. He has a fourth one now as I see it.

In regard to copper switch-off, I understand a decision has been made by ComReg on how that process should work for regulated products on Eir's network. One key distinction we need to make on copper switch-off is on copper removal. Eir has only proposed switching off the copper. There is no plan to remove it from any poles or from any ducting. That would be a concern to the Department. As part of the mobile broadband task force we will bring up over the next number of months the issue of what is the process to remove copper on poles. If as we understand, ComReg is to give a plan to Eir, because it has to do so, we do not believe there will be any copper switched off in the next two to three years. We do not know but that is the indication from ComReg. It could be 2026 before switch-off starts. It will be on a phased basis, area by area.

There is possibly a misconception that the removal of copper is going to be a windfall gain to whoever removes it. Copper is on these poles but it is a very small element of the cable and it is surrounded by a lot of steel protection. It will cost a lot of money to remove. Whether there is eventually a significant gain from removing it is yet to be seen and that again depends on the price of copper on any given day and spot markets and so forth. It is a very big project. One of the things we are going to look into with ComReg and through our own Department is how we actually get a communication process throughout the country so that people understand what this means. In the event that people are on copper and they need it for a cash machine, a pharmacy or indeed for medical devices in the home, we need to ensure the power does not go off. That is part of the ComReg job and it is part of the decision it published, that the consumer and the end user is not to be negatively impacted by the switching off or removal of copper and there is a seamless transition to the next available technology. Mary or Johnny Murphy should not see the difference. That is what the decision from ComReg says, as I understand it. On the cost differential, ComReg also said they should not see a cost, or certainly a cost that is overly burdensome, in that transition. That is what the decision says, as I understand it. That was published just a few weeks ago. It was notified to the European Commission and that is in place, as I understand it, in law.

The main point is that copper switch-off is a big project. Something akin to that was done a number of years ago, and that was analogue switch-off. Television was moved from analogue to digital, and as we all know that required a significant campaign. Even though only a couple of hundred thousand people were on analogue at the time, it was necessary to get them on to set-top boxes so that they saw no difficulty moving from analogue to digital. The same process and project will be required to go from copper to fibre because there will be hundreds of thousands people who may or may not want to go to fibre, for whatever reason, but who will be required to go onto fibre or an alternative technology because copper will not be available for voice and broadband beyond 2026 or 2027. However, between now and then, the project will be to get a communications process and project in place between the regulator, our Department, the industry and other stakeholders and consumer groups to make sure end users, in particular vulnerable people, are not negatively impacted by this project. That is all I can say on that.

In regard to USO, that is now enshrined in law. The legislation passed in the summer so we now have a universal service mandate for broadband and voice that was not there heretofore. Voice has been there for past 20 years. It has been replaced by the new code but now we have broadband. Part of the job in my Department now is to define what adequate broadband means for USO and what affordability means. We will be bringing forward proposals on that to the Government in the next 18 months. There will be public policy decisions.

Is adequate broadband 100 Mbps, 500 Mbps or 500 Gbps? Those are the big policy questions we are going to have to deal with, along with what affordability means for voice and broadband. It is now a universal service right for every citizen to have adequate broadband at an affordable price and that has been in law since June.