Tom Clonan (Independent) | Oireachtas source

I have not asked Dr. Goldman a question about them.

As a layperson, let me give some context and then I will ask a question. My son had spinal surgery in Temple Street hospital in 2018. He was 18 years old. He should have had that surgery when he was around 12 but he did not because it is Ireland and he was on an extremely long waiting list. His curvature was so pronounced that it compressed his organs and compromised his lung function so that he had something like 20% lung function. I do not know what the witnesses' higher specialist training is. I do not know what their memberships or fellowships are or what their discipline areas are. However, as a layperson, I know that is wrong. That should not happen. It is foreseeable, preventable and reportable.

Before surgery, he had to have a cardiac review. The cardiologist on the scan discovered that his heart was in a part of his chest cavity where it should not be. It was a teaching point, and she called her team over to have a look at it. Eoghan saw it on the screen and he vomited into the sink at the sheer shock of it. He said "It is all right for you. It is not your heart." The anaesthetist told us that he was an anaesthetic risk and that he might be inoperable, as is the case for some of the other parents here.

We went into surgery. The surgical teams were brilliant. The surgeons, the likes of Damian McCormack and Mr. Green. I was in the hospital in Temple Street when Ms Hardiman was CEO. I slept in my car outside on the street. Eventually I got a room after a number of days. I brought my son in. He was frightened, and he was wearing his mother's bracelet. When they gave him the initial little numbing rope to put the peripherally-inserted central catheter, PICC line in, or whatever it is, I was ushered out, handed his bracelet and left in the stairwell. That surgery was complex because of the delay.

Dr. Goldman comes from Great Ormond Street Hospital for Children, according to his LinkedIn profile. He sees a cohort of patients and a way of treating people that is completely and utterly out of step with what happens in the rest of Europe, in terms of chronic delay. Did he report it to the international literature? Did he blow the whistle? Were research teams not invited to come in and look at this extraordinary hospital where all of these extremely complex surgeries take place because of delayed treatment? If not, why not, and can the witnesses stand over this system that we have, with all of these suboptimal outcomes? One patient was brought back on 33 separate occasions. At what point did the witnesses think, or did they ever think about that? The springs are just a symptom of a completely dysfunctional system that Ms Hardiman has presided over as CEO since 2018, and she came in here with two clinicians who blew the whistle.

Were the Boston group and the other review patient-centred? Did they involve the families? I think we are not seeing the wood for the trees here. Everything we are talking about here, and all of these investigations, are used as a rhetorical device to not answer questions. This is something that the HSE has employed under Paul Reid's stewardship and that of his predecessor. I do not know what Bernard Gloster is going to be like. It is often stated that individual cases cannot be commented on, or that there is an investigation under way. These are all rhetorical devices to evade the blindingly obvious about what was happening in Temple Street. I only know from my own experience. I know that what happened was unusual and I am very grateful to the surgeons who intervened. Ms Hardiman must know, as a medical professional who has been CEO of the hospital and prior to that was CEO at Tallaght Hospital. If she had a cardiac unit in Tallaght hospital that was performing suboptimally to that extent, would she not, like the airline industry, blow the whistle and call for help? If it was an oncology department that was performing in that way, would she not call for help? If it was a maternity hospital that was performing in such a strange way, would she not? She did not, and the reason why she did not is that our children are disabled children and do not have the value in Irish society of other human beings. I am surprised that Dr. Goldman came here from another jurisdiction and felt that was - I do not know what to call it; I just do not know.

I would like to invite Ms Hardiman and Dr. Goldman, in the time that is remaining, to tell me how their behaviour was consistent with their remaining as CEO and chief medical officer, CMO of CHI, respectively. I am a layperson, and I know this instinctively. Modern medicine is led and informed by research for best practices. What the witnesses are presiding over was a recurring, foreseeable, predictable pattern of suboptimal outcomes, leaving children on waiting lists for so long.

What did you do about it? Damian McCormack and the other fella came in here and blew the whistle. When did you blow the whistle, and if not, why not? If you did not, is your position tenable or credible?