Éamon Ó Cuív (Galway West, Fianna Fail) | Oireachtas source

I will just come back in on the SICAP. These programmes are valuable but whether it is sufficient is a different issue. Does Ms Kelly have any metrics, especially in very disadvantaged communities, with regard to the actual impact this is having in terms of third-level access or a reduction in the number of people who wind up in prison? Are these societal programmes having the impact? If they are not then they are totally insufficient.

There are two types of what we call deprivation. There is one concerning the individual, which we can have in any community. Then, there is the more agglomerated form we used to call rejuvenating areas through planning, investment and development, RAPID, where we get huge areas of challenge, which has a lateral effect within the community where we get very low educational attainment and, unfortunately, relatively higher numbers going to prison, more antisocial behaviour, more drug use and all these things. Are we making any impression on any of these things? At the end of the day, we can measure all the metrics we want, but these are the only and the ultimate metrics that should count to us on this side of the room.