Dr. John Sheehan:

That is key to the whole thing. Let us not get too caught up with timeframes and dates because it will evolve within the timeframes. I am a little bemused that ten years might be seen as too long. It was only in September or October 2018 that the Oireachtas passed a 20-year plan for Project Ireland 2040. It had no difficulty doing that. I cannot understand why ten years seems to be anathema now. LAMA would say that the ten-year plan with robust reviews is welcome, and that was in our presentation today. When we say robust reviews, it means that the material contraventions can come from both sides of the establishment.

To follow on from Deputy Ó Broin's point regarding whether they are ministerial orders or instructions or whatever they are, I would say the carrot rather than the stick approach is best used by Ministers. Believe it or not - I do not know whether the Senator is aware of it - pound for pound, there are good councillors out there-----