Eugene Murphy (Fianna Fail) | Oireachtas source

I acknowledge the presence of the witnesses. Ms Thornton had an engagement with me some time back and I picked up a lot from that, which I appreciate.

I am sorry for returning to something that has probably been addressed already and I will keep it short due to the pressure of time. I was listening in my office and, as far as I can recall, Deputy Kerrane spoke about cost-of-living factors. I want to return to that because I was not present for the answers. I do not mind if the witnesses abbreviate the answer if they have given it already.

I meet regularly with small groups of people in my constituency, as my constituency colleagues do, and one of the issues I discussed recently was pensions. There were some questions that came up with young people, young couples and single parents, in particular. For example, our economy is pretty good now and although we are concerned that every second day there is an announcement about tech job losses, we are still told there is not going to be a collapse in that sector. In reality, however, we do not know what is going to happen. What happens to people if they lose their jobs and they are in auto-enrolment? Can they get that readjusted? Can they pay less? These are the type of things that are worrying people.

Second, to go back to the point made by Deputy Ó Cathasaigh, there is a lot of mistrust of the insurance industry. I do not mean that with any disrespect to any of the people involved but it is due to happenings down through the years and bad experiences people have had. When we go back to the big crash, all of the most influential and expert people told us there was going to be a soft landing, but I think that ball is still hopping in some quarters of Irish society.

There was anything but a soft landing.

People have genuinely asked what happens if there is some type of crisis or crash. We can talk about all the guarantees in the world but we live in an uncertain world and I can understand how people would ask these questions. Interest rates are increasing and everybody knows the cost of everything is going through the roof. Covid has not helped, and nor has the war in Ukraine, but I am still quite positive about the Irish economy. We all need to address the pension issue but how can we guarantee that if we enter a financial crisis and people find they are no longer able to pay the amount of money they are paying, their payments can be readjusted? These are the type of questions people are asking.

There is no public debate about this idea. The committee is discussing it, as are our witnesses and various other groups appearing before us, but the type of debate that is needed is not happening. No more than Deputy Ó Cathasaigh and other people, I was careless about my pension for years. I spent money on holidays, cars and everything else and I did not think about it. There are challenges with getting this through. I cannot see that happening by 2024. I ask the witnesses to response on those points.