Mark Wall (Labour) | Oireachtas source

I thank our guests for coming in this morning for this important debate. Based on my 16 short years as a public representative, I would like to thank all the CWOs out there because, as was rightly said, they have a difficult job. They are competent in the job they do and every one of them I have dealt with in those 16 years does their job to the best of their ability. The problem, as Deputy Kerrane said, is that I am now being told I should be using emails when contacting those CWOs; that is the difference. If it was not for the CWOs I still have phone numbers for, I would not have contact with CWOs. That is wrong. It is a backward step. It is totally backward. I agree with Deputy Kerrane regarding Mr. Hession's opening statement in which he stated, "Local face-to-face engagement with customers continues to be a cornerstone of the community welfare service". I am not finding that on the ground. I am finding, like Deputy Kerrane, that it has been centralised. I have used this word several times, as have my colleagues. It is centralised into Intreo centres and now we are talking about hubs. What is the difference between a hub and an Intreo centre? Where are we going with the hub? Is the hub going to replace the 50 Intreo centres? Is that the intention of the community welfare service?

Mr. Hession also said in his opening statement that a "part-time service is provided at scheduled hours at a range of other locations". Where are those locations? Are those locations advertised? Will Mr. Hession send that information to the committee? In my experience in Athy, County Kildare, where I live, 16 years ago there was a drop-in service where one could go and talk to the CWO. As Deputy Kerrane said, Johnny and Mary would know that person and, more importantly, the CWO would know Johnny and Mary. A relationship developed with those people who needed the service most. That is gone because Johnny and Mary now have to travel to Newbridge to meet a community welfare service staff member, other than the CWO, who many answer a phone call. That is what is happening with the community welfare service. It is being centralised; I cannot emphasise that enough. That public representatives are being asked to send in representations through email and not to contact the CWO is a regressive step.

Funeral and burial expenses are a cornerstone of what the community welfare service does, but this has now been centralised. I have dealt with three cases in the last few weeks, involving three different families who received multiple letters from the CWO, the hub or the Intreo service asking for the same information. Once is bad enough; twice is criminal. I am asking about and raising this issue because I was the one, as their public representative, who sent this in at the first stage, yet they got the same information requests coming back to them twice and in one case, three times. That is wrong. It is not what the community welfare service was set up for in the first place.

Another issue that has been coming up regularly, and which I have raised regularly at this committee, is the area of housing aid, housing adaptation grants and the fact that they are set at a limit. I have asked the community welfare service to supplement that. Building costs are going through the roof so more and more people are coming to us asking us to supplement them. I would like an opinion from the witnesses about that. I have had success getting top-ups but it has been limited. For the housing aid grant, the maximum limit is €8,000 and for the housing adaptation grant, the maximum limit is €30,000. Unfortunately, some of the people who need it most are not getting it. Will the Department of Social Protection look at that? It is an essential part of the service. Until there is a new housing adaptation grant, CWOs should step in rather than sending a letter back to the individual saying that it is the local authority's business. It is not the local authority's business; they only have a set limit and those people who need it most should be helped by the community welfare service. I have had some success with that but unfortunately in other cases they have not gotten through the system and the people in question are still without that grant.

Mr. Hession mentioned that the service has 412 staff across all grades. If there were to be a staff meeting today, how many of them would be at the meeting? In other words, how many of those 412 staff are on leave? How many are out sick? How many actual staff members are there in the community welfare service? That is an important question because I am hearing that more and more CWOs are under pressure, are doing more and more and are doing multiple jobs. Will the witnesses comment on that?

Regarding the telephone answering service, it was stated that there are 1,700 calls a week. Who answers those calls? Is it a clerical officer or a CWO? If it is a CWO, that person is being taken away from another job they should be doing. If it is a clerical officer, how much experience does that clerical officer have of dealing with a claim? That is a huge problem. I honestly believe it is a huge problem at the moment. I am hearing that when these applications go into the hub, it is multiple weeks, from ten to 12 weeks, before the CWO sees the claim because there are issues with the clerical officers. I accept they have to be trained. The witnesses may say this is right or wrong; maybe my information is wrong. Before the CWO gets to see the claim, it can be anything up to ten or 12 weeks. That is leading to the problems there are with the service and the delay in people getting the services at the moment.

The community welfare service was always a great service. It helped the constituents I dealt with for 16 years. The centralisation that is happening is taking the CWO out of the community. The hubs are a retrograde step. Will the witnesses better explain the hubs and who is running them? Now, people have to get on buses where possible and, as Deputy Kerrane said, there is no public transport in other areas. This is wrong. I accept we have to move with the times. I welcome the fact that there will be an online service, but as has been said, not everybody is available and able to get online. Unfortunately, most of the people who need the services of the CWO are not in a position to go online, whereas others may be.