Mr. Leo Kearns:

The Deputy is absolutely right. When people get into care, they find it is very good, generally speaking. People have a great experience. The problem is with access. People's trust then erodes. Many people are worried about having to go into an accident and emergency department and whether they may have to wait for 24 hours on a chair or what might be going to happen to them. For the staff watching this, it is incredibly difficult. One of the big issues we have, particularly after Covid-19, is that the stress of working in healthcare is so significant. The past two and a half years have just amplified this aspect, but it existed before the pandemic as well. We have set up the system in such a fragmented and poorly governed way, but the people working in healthcare are trying to do their best.

This is the case at every level. I can see it within the Department, the HSE centre and right out onto the front line. People have, I will not say burned out, but there is a significant burnout element to this context. This is why we must put such a great focus on this aspect. This situation is not sustainable. It is not that this change is a nice thing to do, it is that we cannot go on like this. It is probably also important for me to say that the cross-party support Sláintecare brought in is critical to this endeavour. Having political support - joined-up political support - for this process is absolutely necessary. It will give people confidence that if there is this kind of support and coherence with the Department, the HSE and the front line, then there is some hope this situation is going to improve. This is important.