Ms Gillian Harford:

You raised a very interesting question to which there are many different facets. I will start at the end rather than the beginning, to echo Ms O'Caoimh's point. Typically, we see the debate, especially when we talk about targets and quotas, as not the difference between what they are but the difference between merit and targets and quotas. We absolutely support the view that there is no expectation that targets and quotas do not count merit. Whether a woman is appointed through a target, a quota or a totally non-designated process, it is on the basis of merit, especially from an organisation point of view.

I will not claim to comment here as an expert on the electoral process but as a citizen and a voter. The two scenarios are slightly different. One scenario involves multiple parties - excuse the pun - with one outcome. When we look at targets and quotas for business, one entity is looking at making decisions on many outcomes. Having only one entity puts far more pressure on it with regard to employee, investor and competitive expectations in the procurement world. The business has an incentive.

What our experience in the business space shows us is that quotas become the ceiling. Once an organisation has met the quota, it is managed within the compliance world and the box is ticked. What we see is that when organisations are encouraged to think about the business benefits - actively encouraged by the wider business community - by initiatives such as balance for better business, it becomes a starting point because as soon as they get to 30, the next question is when they will be at 40 or 50.

Until we have evidence that shows to the contrary that countries that have gone very far down the quota route that it improves aspects for women especially in executive roles, we still see that targets as where one goes until they fail. We still do not have evidence of countries that have gone beyond listed organisations which is a challenge. If Ireland were to go down this route, we would be trailblazing in an area where there is already evidence that in listed organisations, this has not been overly successful.

We are in 18 chapters around the world. I speak to colleagues in many different countries. We see Australia, Canada, the UK and Ireland sharing where industry is stepping up to change the landscape. We talk to colleagues in France, Germany, Poland and Italy and we still see diversity as part of the compliance conversation rather than the business conversation and we think that is what would make the difference. If business has to step up, not because it is the good or right thing to do, but because it makes absolute business sense, that stops it being a ceiling and turns it into a floor from which business stretches.