Brendan Smith (Cavan-Monaghan, Fianna Fail) | Oireachtas source

I welcome the witnesses and thank them for their initial contributions. It is obvious that a great deal of work is being undertaken by the three commissions. Importantly, it was stated that there is a framework for co-operation. It has often been a concern for us when there are different commissions whose work may run in parallel that there might be duplication and a lesser return overall as a result. I am glad to see there is a good framework of co-operation and collaboration because that is how the best results can be achieved for the people who need these services and supports. In this context, it is also important that there is an all-Ireland dimension to the work of the three commissions. I say that because these issues do not stop at the Border.

The Good Friday Agreement was a huge achievement and so many people contributed to bringing it about. It was about parity of esteem and ensuring people were treated equally regardless of their religious or political beliefs. It is disappointing, to say the least, that we are now back at a stage where we are concerned about the diminution of rights. It is not acceptable. It is disappointing we have come to this day with different legislative measures being proposed by the British Government.

On the Northern Ireland Troubles (Legacy and Reconciliation) Bill, we have discussed our outright opposition to those proposals on many occasions with different groups. It is not every day of the week that all the political parties in Northern Ireland, all the victims' groups and all the advocates for people are speaking in unison on an issue in this way, as are the political voices in this State too. It is deplorable that the British Government has brought forward these proposals that allow people to give themselves immunity from prosecution. People who committed murder can enter into the process being proposed through this legislation and practically give themselves immunity. That is not acceptable in any democracy. I heard representatives from other groups speak about General Pinochet's regime, and others. Talk about tinpot regimes. We would be talking about the deplorable activities of regimes elsewhere if something like this happened in South America. We do not expect that type of activity on a neighbouring island, in Europe or in what we generally refer to as the western world. I sincerely hope the new British Government will take a different approach.

All of us as public representatives, and the witnesses will know this through their work, have dealt with families who have been campaigning for decades to try to get to the truth of what happened to their loved ones and family members. We cannot emphasise often enough that those people have campaigned with great grace and dignity. They are not out for vengeance but just to get the truth. To tell those families, individuals, neighbours, friends and communities that have campaigned to try to get to the truth about what happened to loved ones or community members that all that work has been in vain and can just be washed away with legislation is not good enough and is unacceptable. It cannot be accepted in any form, and I sincerely hope the new British Prime Minister and new Secretary of State for Northern Ireland will revisit this issue in a practical way.

As we all know, a process was put in place in 2014 to deal with legacy issues. It was a hard-won agreement to secure the creation of those structures and this is what should be implemented. Those necessary mechanisms should be properly resourced so people can get to the truth of what happened. We have all met people in this situation. For decades now, I have worked alongside families who have lost loved ones and who have never got the truth. To try to tell those people that all their work has been in vain and all they have done has been pointless would be a deplorable act in any democratic system.

I applaud the work of the witnesses. All three commissioners mentioned other work in progress. They should keep us informed when there are findings regarding those issues because they will be important for our work as well. We have the WAVE Trauma Centre in Belfast, Derry and elsewhere and other good advocacy groups. We must commend their outstanding work and the support they give to families and victims while working in what must be exceptionally difficult circumstances. We must applaud their work and support them in every way possible.

On the British Nationality and Borders Act 2022, Deputies Tully and Conway-Walsh asked whether information is available on the numbers of people who have been stopped. Do we have any concrete evidence in this regard? Apart from people being checked, there is also the environment now in which some people are uncertain and afraid they might be stopped. Ms Gibney referred to there being 30,000 cross-Border movements daily. That is great to see. These are people crossing over the Border to go to work, attend education, access health services, visit family and go about social activities. Any of us who visits a school, hospital or building site will be able to see the registration of the cars parked in these places of work. If that is in Northern Ireland, we will see Southern-registered cars, while here in this State we will see Northern-registered cars. This demonstrates that people are travelling and providing worthwhile services. I am thinking of people in my neighbouring area of County Fermanagh who work in Cavan daily, and vice versa. For people without British or Irish citizenship, however, there is a concern at the back of their minds about whether they will be stopped. I take the opportunity to commend the work of the North West Migrants Forum, NWMF. I met representatives of the group some time ago. It is a great group, which advocates on behalf of people who feel vulnerable. We must bear in mind their concerns at all times.

I think it was Ms McGahey who referred to the loss of EU funding and how that can impact on the work of the three commissions. I presume IHREC is funded directly by the Government. If there is no direct State funding for the other two commissions, are they dependent on EU or other programmes, for funding? I would have thought the work of the three commissions should be funded directly by the relevant line Department in each State, instead of having to depend on EU programmes that do not last for more than five years.