Paschal Donohoe (Dublin Central, Fine Gael) | Oireachtas source

I thank Deputy Michael Healy-Rae for the points he raised. I know he has an understanding of the real world, especially small businesses. Like the Minister, Deputy McGrath, I have been approached directly by businesses, which have sent me pictures of their bills. I fully understand the challenge that is developing and the need to respond to it. I agree with everything the Minister, Deputy McGrath, has said on that. I will add two points to that. I say this to Deputy Healy-Rae with respect and the same honesty with which he has spoken to me.

The first point I would respectfully make is that if the benchmark for whenever the Government tries to help the economy is what we did during Covid, we will run out of money. The Covid pandemic was an extraordinary and, I hope, please God, a once-in-a-generation experience in which people could not leave their home. I know the Deputy understands this because I heard him speak about it in the Dáil and he has raised what that meant for businesses with me for two years. A set of things came together that, please God, none of us will ever have to confront again. We had to do things at such a scale because of the terrible harm it would do to people's health and what would happen to the basic functioning of businesses and our economy if we did not intervene. It cannot be the benchmark the Government is compared with every time we have to intervene again. If the Government is asked to take that approach, in all honesty, the people who will suffer in the years to come are the people who Deputy Healy-Rae is representing, because the public finances will not be able to afford it, our debt will go up, and we know what happens after that.

We will do all that we can to help to make a difference. The Minister, Deputy McGrath, used the phrase "incomplete information". We do not know for how long this situation could continue and what else could be around the corner. We have to temper what we are doing with that in mind. I ask the Deputy to consider that, every time we have to respond to a shock, if the Deputy expects us to do what we did during Covid, we will quickly have bigger trouble on our hands. We are trying to manage that.

I take the point about solar panels. We will have to look at that. The job of the State and whoever is in government is not just to find money to make solar panels cheaper but to find money to keep hospitals running and to respond to all the other needs the Deputy is referring to. As much as we want to make things that we value affordable, at the same time the Government cannot do everything. Few people understand that better than Deputy Healy-Rae, because of his background and the fact there is a big business community in Kerry that understands what is going on in the world. I fully understand the challenge many are facing, but I hope the Deputy will appreciate my candour in asking him to consider other risks. If we are requested to intervene as we did during Covid in every economic shock, we will face an economic shock of our own making at some point soon. None of us want to be in that position.