Mr. Brian Smyth:

Collaboration is key. Mr. Le Roux referred to it as well. We collaborate with the families, advocates, service providers, the HSE, the Brothers of Charity, the National Learning Network, NLN, and farmers, but at the centre of it all are the participants themselves. They are directing what happens within their placements and go where they want to. We do not just place people on farms and leave them indefinitely. There is a goal, and we measure whether it has been achieved and move people along. There is value in all of the supports, elements and collaborators. No service or system is all bad. That is part of the innovation in delivering policy and change. It would be great if someone wanted to rewrite the programmes and systems, but it is not possible to do, so people have to collaborate to bring about change.

That is the key. Innovating is what we live to do in that field, as well as to use the assets there. These farmers provide real value. The distinction here is that it is not employment, though some are taking people on to employment. Farming is under pressure and many farms we have are small scale and would not employ people anyway. However, they can provide valuable support that is absent for many people in, particularly, rural communities, or those people have to get on a bus and travel for an hour to a service and come back in the evening. They can access farms close by in the community and be included and seen as valuable members of the community. There is real value in that. As has been said, the people we have providing that support are in the community and have experience of the difficulties in various sectors. Many families have people working in the services or have experience in the mental health or disability service from their family circumstances and can provide inclusion in that regard.

The cost and value can be measured in any service, whether disability, mental health or other, and we believe in the cost-value of this service. Part of the reason we are having this conversation on 1 June is to look at a cost-benefit analysis of the support provided on farms.