Ms Cathy Wheatley:

Yes, I understand the long-term effects, but I want to put on record that the children are not her children; hey are very much our children.

I appreciate Senator Keogan's comments and understanding of the reasons why we had to avail of surrogacy. In terms of our research and everything that we did, the reason Ukraine was hugely important is due to a couple of factors. First, in order to avail of surrogacy in Ukraine you have to be a heterosexual, married couple and you must have a medical reason for undergoing surrogacy. We met the criteria in that regard. The lengths to which they go to ensure there is a medical reason are robust. I had to get letters from my fertility doctor and send my child's stillborn certificate to them. Lots of paperwork was involved before we even got to the point of being accepted to undergo surrogacy in Ukraine.

Of course we researched the situation. The first thing we did, which we would advise anyone to do, is to get legal advice. We were very lucky in that the legal representation that we got had experience and was able to steer us in the right direction. At the end of the day, we have to be able to make sure that the women carrying our children are being looked after, not just for ourselves but for our children. We bear witness to them. As Ted and Elsie grow up, I have to be able to look them in the eye and tell them that I made sure at every step of the way that the woman who carried them was protected. A couple of ways we did that personally was when we went to Ukraine first, we met her without any agency being involved and we had a chat. We talked about her motives for doing it, why she wanted to do it and whether we thought it would work for all of us together. Then we had a meeting with the agency, as I said. One of the things that was really important to us was that we spent time alone with her at every step of the process, so that she was not being monitored in any way and she had free rein to highlight any problems she was having. We also flew over there when she moved to the city where she was going to give birth. We flew over to check out her accommodation to make sure that it was of a proper standard for her and her children who went with her.

We did due diligence to the best we could to make sure that she was absolutely protected. After our twins were born, they were in the neonatal unit for ten days. Ivana was in hospital for three days. When she left the hospital, she came to stay with us. Because her family lived further away, I felt that I had a responsibility to make sure that she was okay as well. Every day we would go and visit the twins and I asked her if she wanted to come but she would say "No, no, I am done. I will rest and watch TV." Of course she did come, which I felt was really important as well, when we went for the DNA test, so that the Irish officials could be there to make sure that she was okay and that she was there of her own free will. We all travelled together. We did not travel separately. This was very much a relationship that had been built on. She stayed with us after that until she simply had enough of us and she wanted to go home to her own family. That was the point when she left and went home to her boys. She was taken into hospital early and her mother had not yet arrived to look after her children so while she was in hospital having my children, I cared for her children. The relationship that was there was very solid. I trusted her with mine and so she trusted me with hers. We went through everything that we possibly could in that regard.

Ted and Elsie are two and a half now and we speak to Ivana and her children regularly. We send little drawings back and forward. I can say 100% that she does not consider herself the mother of the children, because I am.

Ivana is living with us due to the crisis in Ukraine. I felt like I needed to do something to protect her, just like she had protected my children. She is living with us in a two-bedroom cottage in County Wicklow. We have three adults and five children in our little cottage. It does not matter if we have no room in the house, however, because there is plenty of room in our hearts. We are able to prove to Ivana that when I stood in her kitchen and told her she was part of our family-----