Damien English (Meath West, Fine Gael) | Oireachtas source

I want to be clear. We have done the maths on this scheme and we have come in at a figure of 70%, which we believe is fair and reasonable. I do not want to give the impression that we are going to go away and come back on Report Stage with an increase on that because that is not the intention. As with every discussion we have here, we will reflect on it, we will talk to the Tánaiste and to our officials and we will work through this. However, a lot of work has been done to achieve that target of 70%. I did not say it is the norm across Europe to have 70%. In many cases, it is a lot less and goes down as far as 25%, although I accept it is higher in some cases. I am not saying that the norm is 70%. We are above the norm or above the average. We have put forward a reasonable proposal.

It is set out in regulation, for the reasons I laid out at the start. That gives scope to the Minister to react and to adjust accordingly over the years, as opposed to having to bring in primary legislation, which can be very time-consuming. That is there as well.

We share Deputy Ó Ríordáin’s understanding and concerns and that is why we are bringing forward the legislation. As a Government, we understand both the barriers that are out there and the necessity for this. That is why we are proposing it and bringing it forward, with the support of the Deputies. We are in tune with what is happening out there as well. We think we have the balance right on this, and we will monitor the position in that regard. It goes back to the balance and the costs that we put on employers because they also have to be able to balance their books and to survive. We want to have as many jobs as possible. We want people who are on low pay to be able to constantly aim to get a job, improve their job and build on their terms and conditions, if that is what they want to do, in order to be able to pay their bills and look after their families. They should not have that fear that I know is out there, which is “If one of us gets sick tomorrow or next week, how do we manage and how do we pay the bills?” That is why it is important to have good-quality, well-paying jobs with good terms and conditions. For that to happen, we have to have a balanced enterprise environment to manage that and to create those jobs in the first place.

It is a chicken-and-egg situation, but we will check and monitor this. It is in regulation that the Minister of the day can adjust this through regulation, as opposed to having to go back to primary legislation. However, I do not want to give the impression that we have not done the maths and that we are going to run out and change it, and then come back here on Report Stage. That is not the intention. It is linked to the average wage. We think we have the balance right. As I said, naturally, we will at every stage review what we are doing and keep an eye on that. However, that is where our homework has brought us to at this moment.