Mr. Ciar?n O'Connor:

With regard to timber, Scotland has a very similar but wetter climate than ours, yet it is using a higher quantum of timber frames. As Mr. Barry mentioned, we are at about 23% in housing while Scotland is at approximately 75%. Part of the problem we have is that we are importing timber from Scotland. For instance, Glennon Brothers in the midlands, in Longford, are importing about 400 cu. m of timber every year to keep their mill going. There is an imbalance when that has to be done. Part of the reason is that we have stalled. We did very well for some time. When Ireland became independent, it had forest cover of 1%. It now has cover of 12%. Members of all Governments played a role in that. To move from 11% or 12% to between 18% and 20%, we need to get farmers to plant. That depends on the land. The land we have had to date suits certain types of trees. Better land allows for more diversity in what is grown. Sometimes people say it is a question of either conifers or broadleafs. It is not really a question of either-or but of and - both have a role to play in forestry, including in embodying carbon and reducing the carbon footprint.

Our system is set up such that separate licences have to be got for planting, putting in the road, extracting and clear-felling. To me, that does not make sense. The Scots have just one licence. Why can we not do that? What has happened is that we have made the process too academic and overly structured. We need to simplify it. We must ask what terrible thing has happened in Scotland that would have us not take the same approach here. No such thing has happened. We can learn from that.

We could also learn from the Austrians and the French in that they do not clear-fell at the same scale as us. We do a much bigger clear-fell as a percentage of the woodland. That has to do with how trees are planted, the species planted and the mix. The Austrians and French have a zero-bare-canopy approach. That is achievable, but there must be different forestry methodologies. Coillte is interested in this. We have had meetings with Coillte.

There was a related question on levels of co-operation. We are co-operating with Coillte on the third iteration of a publication - Wood Specification - we first produced with it 12 years ago. We have a masonry culture in Ireland and must ask how we can introduce a timber culture. When I worked in Scandinavia and Canada for many years, those regions had timber cultures because that is the way they have grown up. We have grown up with a masonry culture but now need timber-based technology at an equal level. People have to treat timber with respect. If they do not, it rots and things happen to it. There has to be a knowledge base. This is why the technology element, which was spoken about earlier, is very important. Wood Specification will give people the knowledge base. We are now turning it into something that can be downloaded. The content will be much easier to interact with rather than that in a book. We will have it ready for the end of the year. These are small steps but they are important. In the process, we co-operated with many individuals, including representatives from Coillte. The Department of Agriculture, Food and the Marine is part-funding the book. These are important elements.

It is easy to say we can get a pile of timber but it is a matter of what you do with it and how you put it through a process. We must ask what side industries can be had. The Finns, for example, have a furniture industry based on timber, in addition to paper, manufacturing and construction industries. We need to get that mix. Our economy is a bit too small in some regards, and we are a bit more remote. The Finns, by contrast, can go right into the rest of Europe from the south of their country. These are things we have to recognise.

Another topic to be considered is cross-laminated timber. This is what is being used for the high-rise buildings. This is achievable if you have a market of a certain size. At the moment, we do not, but we could, depending on how we treat our next number of steps with our growing population. These are all possibilities but, as with everything that is possible, we must ask what can really be made happen and those things that are a bit further away.