Jennifer Murnane O'Connor (Carlow-Kilkenny, Fianna Fail) | Oireachtas source

They are powerful. What has been said has been so truthful. All of us would recognise that from our own areas, where we come across these issues, so it is important that they are highlighted and that we do all we can.

I had a few questions about recruitment but a lot of them have been answered. Where there is an issue with recruitment, there is a broken system. I know that everybody is doing their best and that there is funding there, but the issue is that when people are overworked and doing maybe the job of two people because there are not enough staff, straight away there is a failure.

It is no one's fault, but a fault of the system. That must be addressed. How we recruit and keep our people within the system also needs to be sorted. I agree completely on this point.

Safeguarding is extremely important, and this is another issue I wish to address. Regarding safeguarding policies, as someone who works on the ground, like my colleagues, I firmly believe it is necessary to listen to the representatives of disability organisations, service providers and advocacy organisations, because that is where change will come from. In the formulation of any safeguarding policy, we all have a remit to include the people in the know.

I am working with people who come to talk to me about carers and respite. If we examine this issue, we have more than 400 carers aged over 80. We are promoting a system where people will continue to live at home, but I will give examples of two cases absolutely breaking me at this stage. We talk about the lived experience in this context. I have many other cases, but these are just two examples of situations I am dealing with now. The lady in question in one of these cases is in her 90s and she forgets things. Her son is her carer and he is in his 70s. This lady is in hospital now. She has said she would like to go home. The family does not want that because they are so upset. The lady herself is forgetful and does not remember things. Yet the hospital has said she can go home. I reiterate, however, that this lady is well into her 90s and forgets things, while her son is in his 70s and he is very sick. I have told the family members they must go back to the people overseeing the system and say that. The family members are upset about this situation. They are fighting the system because they need to get this lady into a nursing home. They do not want to do that. Do not get me wrong in this regard, because this family is dedicated and committed. There is a concern when situations like this arise, where we have a system that says a lady like this can go home but, technically, she cannot. How do we try to get a system that works?

Another case I have come across involves a lady in her 80s with motor neurone disease. She has been told by the hospital authorities that she can go home but there is no care package for her. When people ask me about care packages, I tell them they will get half an hour, three times a day if they are lucky and get a care package when someone comes home from hospital. If not, the family concerned will be fighting to get that person into a nursing home. These are the realities. I could point to many other people in similar situations.

We need policies and we must examine the system, but if we do not work with the families in the system, then how is this going to work? Families are greatly tormented by what their loved ones are going through. These are good families living this experience every day. They are telling the hospital authorities they want to take their mam or dad home, while wondering how they can do it. They ask about home care packages, only to be told that none are available. That is the case now, even though private providers are being considered. The best efforts are being made in this context because those private providers are being considered. I refer to the HSE. I am not blaming anybody here because I do not know where to start.

My issue is that our society is one where families have parents who are living longer, but we are unable to cater for this reality. We are dealing with situations where families are trying to get their loved ones into nursing homes and it is necessary to engage with the system to do so. This is another battle people face. How do we fix this system? It is failing at certain times and we must examine this. I cannot say this is the situation in all cases, because everybody is doing their best and I am not here to be the bad guy in this context.

We must also explore the culture that exists in this regard. The committee meets weekly. I also work with people on the ground and I am very much involved with the different disability groups in County Carlow. They do a great job, by the way. The reality in this context, however, no matter what is being sought, whether it is a grant for a bathroom adaptation, a stairlift or an extension, is that there is nearly another battle to be faced. I just feel every day in my life is a battle. I come in here then and I am constantly giving out. I feel I am living the reality of what is happening on the ground and listening to the groups and families who have these experiences. In this context, it is important that we have HIQA and the inspections it undertakes to know if things are correct. Regarding those inspections, however, what are the timescales involved if funding is needed? What is the process that follows from there? I ask this because it is important that we have these processes and I welcome them.

I could raise so many other issues, but there are time pressures. I thank the witnesses for attending. What they said today is true and it was important for us to listen to it. In turn, I ask the witnesses to listen to the representatives of all the different groups and to us, as representatives of the people who feel they are breaking point. I feel I am almost at breaking point myself sometimes, because I am fighting with everybody to try to get everything done. I thank the witnesses again. Perhaps they could respond to me later and there might be some solutions to these problems.