Ms Marie Donnelly:

I thank the Chairman and other members of the committee for the opportunity to have this conversation following on from the previous one we had a couple of weeks ago. They can rest assured that the council and the carbon budget committee members are entirely at the disposal of the committee for any questions it might have or any analysis that would be of benefit to it. The committee should not hesitate at any stage to make contact with us. We will certainly try to facilitate that.

I return to the earlier question about the connection between science and policy and between policy and politics. If I stand back and look at where we are in Ireland, first, we have set ourselves a really ambitious target. As Professor Ó Gallachóir has said, we have about the second highest ambition globally at the moment. We have even put it in legislation and set out a mechanism to have a roadmap with milestones to achieve that. A milestone in this context is the carbon budget and it is built on science. I hope the discussion today has illustrated the depth of scientific expertise that has been brought to bear in terms of the carbon budget recommendations that have been made. Again, I express sincere gratitude to all the members of the carbon budget committee and their colleagues behind them who have supported the work on and development of the proposals we were able to come up with at the end of last year.

The next step, hopefully, is the finalisation of the carbon budget but, equally, the policies necessary in order to travel this road of transition to achieve its objectives. Already, the Chairman has pinpointed the necessary element in the legislation, namely, the feedback loop mechanism. That is built into the legislation and this is the mandate the committee has placed on the shoulders of the council. We came out with some preliminary comments in our annual review in November gone by but we are now putting in place a structured approach to each of the sectors to monitor and assess their performance on an annual basis vis-à-visthe sectoral ceilings. This process will run on an ongoing basis and be reflected not just in punctual comments by the council, and there will be punctual comments, but as an intrinsic part of our annual review process.

To return to an earlier question because it is important that we link this, this transition is really about the hearts and minds of people. We can have market mechanisms, regulations and technologies but if the hearts and minds of the population of the country are not fully engrossed in this exercise in the way that they feel it is part of their future, not just a political or policy objective, and it is something people want for themselves, their families and their future, we will not be able to do it. In that context, one of the challenges we have is translating all of the science we were talking about today into some sort of vision that is entirely understandable by everybody in the country. What does 1 January 2050 actually look like in Ireland? When we wake up - if we wake up that far head is a bit of question - what will Ireland look like? What is the vision we have for Ireland? In order to develop that vision, we need a lot of information and we need to have a lot of dialogue with people in the country. We need to have the supports that will allow the people of the country to move in that direction - incentives, market mechanisms, regulation and technology.

Perhaps one of the most important issues, and I say it today because I think it is the right place to say it, is the fact that we need leadership. This is the link between science, policy and political parties because at the end of the day, our politicians are our leaders who will set the pace, direction of travel and ambition we will achieve in this space. In that context, the Chairman asked a very pertinent question because the logic is that we should use the science and have the policy mechanism but, most importantly, we need the leadership. In that context, I assure the committee that both the council and the members of the carbon budget committee are available to support it now and as we go forward on this journey. Members should not hesitate to come back to us with any questions they might have. We will be delighted to support and continue the dialogue with this committee.