Ms Tanya Ward:

It is a very important issue to explore.

On the recommendation we made for the childcare scheme, as Ms Smith mentioned, one quarter of her income was going into childcare. As we know, there are great things about the national childcare scheme, but I do not think Ms Smith should have had to experience the issue with market costs at all. If someone happens to live in a part of country where childcare is expensive, he or she will have to pay more. Someone on a low income who is accessing the scheme should not have to worry about that. The scheme should find a way to pay a higher subsidy to that person.

We have been talking to members of SPARK about the way to address this and they said that most of the people they work with have a medical card. That can be used to unlock a higher level of subsidy that would work. The medical card is used in a similar way in other child poverty areas. The medical card rates have not increased in a very long time and that needs to be addressed, but using the medical card is a way to ensure that some of the families on the lowest incomes would not have to deal with the problem of cost. That is something that could be dealt with early on before we move to a new funding model. It is something the Government could implement very quickly.

I am delighted the Deputy picked up on the school meals piece. We know that all the countries that have the best outcomes for children have hot school meals as part of the school day. It exposes children to food that is very good for them, they are more likely to eat it if it is hot and it helps families who are struggling on the breadline on very low incomes. These families are also trying to juggle work. One of the things we saw when restrictions hit and schools closed, even in programmes in Ireland at present, was that families were in crisis around food. This is an area that the Government needs to invest in.

What is amazing about it is that the pilot programmes that have already been run - the former Minister for Employment Affairs and Social Protection, Regina Doherty, initiated this piece of work and it has been followed on by the Minister of State, Deputy Joe O'Brien, and the Minister, Deputy Humphreys, at the Department of Rural and Community Development - is that the data coming back from the schools is very interesting. Staff in one school said that when children left to go to the dentist, they would previously never have come back for the rest of the day, but they came back and stayed for the full day to get the meals. Children were eating vegetables for the first time because they had no access to them at home and their families might not even have cooking facilities. Children were not cranky; they were in better form and all those things that happen. When children are hungry, they find it very hard to learn and, emotionally, they find it very hard to navigate everyday life. We know hot meal programmes really help children to learn and socialise. It is one of those areas where there is a win-win and all children will benefit. Everyone should benefit from these programmes in a very non-stigmatising way.