Richard Bruton (Dublin Bay North, Fine Gael) | Oireachtas source

I have a quick follow-up on the question of measuring. I have seen people quoted as saying Ireland has the lowest level of circularity at something less than 2%. Is that a meaningful performance indicator or a robust statistic to track?

Deputy Cronin touched on another question, which is who pays in this context and how does the concept of sharing the cost of change pan out? How should we approach this? At one level, we have introduced a price for carbon and anybody who uses carbon pays a price, which relieves the State from funding it. It does not relieve the consumer, who can choose products with a high carbon content but will pay more. People choosing the circular economy may avoid carbon and their products will come to the shelves cheaper.

In trying to enable progress, where does the price of what economists might call externalities - bad practice - fit into this?

Underlining what Deputy Cronin asked is whether the taxpayer will be asked to pay for all business to do the right thing in this area. I am interested in Dr. Brennan's insight into that.