Dr. Hannah Daly:

Hydrogen's greatest value will likely come post-2030 and pre-2030 is where our greatest effort will be at the moment. However, it is important for balancing our variable renewables on an isolated grid so there is a strong role for hydrogen, although maybe not in transport.

The question on fairness and how to get public buy-in was interesting. I fully agree that we must use a combination of carrots and sticks to achieve this transition. If rich people get all the carrots and poor people get all the sticks, there will not be public buy-in and it will not be fair. Thus, we must ensure there is a limited role for carbon pricing beyond what we have now because additional carbon pricing will hit people who do not have the opportunity to buy an EV. This goes back to Deputy Leddin's question, which I did not answer, on how to curb the sale of fossil fuel vehicles now. My suggestion is a tax based on the whole-life emissions of a vehicle when it enters the country either new or second-hand. This would basically incentivise the people bringing cars into the country and who can afford new, bigger cars to do that. Also, we have a cap of, I think, €60,000 on a new EV that can attract the subsidy. We should consider bringing that down and differentiating the subsidy on EVs.

Senator Dooley also asked about examples from other jurisdictions. The transport issue is tied up with the housing crisis. If we can make it easy and affordable for families and people to live in an area where they do not need a car, that would be an equitable solution. I am thinking of somewhere that is appealing and has good reliable public transport, where they can walk and cycle to work, bring their kids to school and get shopping without a car. That is a win-win.