Simon Harris (Wicklow, Fine Gael) | Oireachtas source

I thank the Senator. We will deliver three technological universities and we will definitely deliver one for the south-east. I can assure him of that and thank him for his leadership on the matter. I look forward to engaging with him intensively this week on it.

I sincerely thank him for his kind words about my officials in my Department and the HEA, which I echo. In particular, I thank Mr. Ian McKenna in my Department, who has done much work on this. As complicated and as challenging as this is - Brexit solutions will always be imperfect - I can only begin to imagine with dread how much worse things would have been were it not for the work of Mr. McKenna and his team. I acknowledge that.

I agree with the Senator that this is about east and west as well as North and South. I probably dwelt more on North and South in my opening statement but to be really clear, Ireland, particularly the Government and the higher education sector, wants to not only do the same amount with the UK post Brexit but to do more. It is why I have been engaging actively with organisations such as the British Irish Chamber of Commerce, which has brought together many partners and stakeholders. I met the UK universities minister as well and we are trying to sign a new memorandum of understanding with Scotland. We will shortly meet our Welsh counterparts as well.

The Senator made a point about research. The news about Erasmus+ is bad and I cannot fathom why the British did not opt in but that is their business. At least from a research perspective they have decided that they wish to remain a part of Horizon. There is some detail to be seen on how that will fully bottom out but this at least provides a mechanism to continue to formally engage. I am happy to share a note with the committee but I can see the embedded relationship between Science Foundation Ireland and its counterparts in the UK, which is really strong. Brexit or no Brexit, politics or none, the relationship is so strong that I genuinely feel very positive about the future in that regard.

As the Senator alluded to, there is no mechanism for me to enable Irish students to go on Erasmus+ to the North or the UK. Nobody else can go on Erasmus+ to those destinations either. I echo the Senator's point and I want to find ways for Irish students to continue to be able to avail of mobility opportunities in the UK. This is beneficial in an educational sense but it is much more than that. It is a cultural part of the relationship between these two islands and the progress we have made. I will not box in Ireland but we are very interested in exploring opportunities relating to the UK's Turing scheme and any other mechanisms that may take place. I have made that clear to some of my counterparts in the UK.

I am interested by one of the Senator's questions. To be blunt, Ireland is the only English-speaking country within the Erasmus+ programme and I think we will do very well with more students wanting to come here. As we prepare our new international education and research strategy for later this year, we will address how best to deal with that. To be honest, I am a bit more concerned about increasing the number of Irish students going on the programme abroad. Sometimes, in coming from an English-speaking country, there is a tradition of fewer students going abroad than other students coming to English-speaking countries. We saw this with the previous relationship between the EU and UK with the Erasmus programme. This needs to change. We are very proud members of the EU. We want to be at the heart of it and there is political consensus around that in our country. We need more of our students getting educational experience within other member states, with benefits from learning languages, etc., where we are not doing as well as we should.

Our new international education strategy will address both Erasmus+ students coming in and benefits to Irish institutions. Equally, it will consider how to get more Irish students to go out. To be blunt, that will require more funding. I expect Ireland to do better with increased funding from Erasmus+ programmes but the Government will be required to do more too. Looking at the level of support we provide, it is good for some students but for a student from a socio-economically disadvantaged background, it is not yet where it needs to be.

I know it is a view shared across Government we want to work our way through.