Dr. Joanne McCarthy:

I thank Deputy Canney and Senator Higgins. There is a kind of commonality in the issues they raised. I am delighted to see the integrity with which members have listened to us today. I can really hear it in the questions they have asked and that is very welcome. One of the key points to make is that there is a great deal of detail to consider because the area of disability is dense. We know that because we work in the field. Several times, members asked me questions and something popped into the back of my head but I still cannot give a simple answer. The whole subject is really dense.

One of the key points we are taking from this meeting is that we all would really welcome a role for the Taoiseach in the implementation plan. Looking to see where that stitch can be made is very important. Another point is that we need a plan that is not just around telling us how much is going on and the activity that is happening. It would be hugely welcome to have it built into the plan that there would be a consideration of the impact of that activity. We know there is a plethora of policy and legislation that is hanging around and has not been delivered. That needs to be front and centre of the plan in order that we can begin to tick through it systematically. The policy and legislation are there and they have to be implemented.

Senator Higgins spoke about the big things that need to be done. We too often think about disability services in terms of little boxes. We talk about the people who get day services, for example, and the people who get personal assistance hours. In fact, the convention asks us to think about what we have to do to ensure people can have ordinary but good-quality lives in ordinary places. Article 19, one of the core articles in the convention, deals with the right to live independently. We need to ask whether people have the right to personal assistance hours and whether the State is planning for the appropriate hours. We talk about a statutory right to home care services. That right will be a noose around the neck of many people with disabilities because, although it will give them the right to have someone come into their home to get them out of bed in the morning, they will then be trapped like a prisoner in their own home because they will not have the personal assistance supports to enable them to attend further education, go to work, do the shopping or meet friends. No single Department can answer the right of people to have a good-quality life that is worth living in the community.

When we think about the implementation plan, we must go through the Acts and policies that are yet to be delivered. Then we have to think about the fact that doing more of the same is not going to give us what we need. We need to think about our expectation and what is put into the system to invest in delivery. We have talked about the digital poverty experience of people with disabilities, an issue that the Disability Federation of Ireland and others have been talking about for some time. We highlighted that issue at an Oireachtas committee meeting we attended in 2017. It took a pandemic, when everything went online, for us to see the real lived evidence of that. People could not access any services because they did not have access to computers, were not trained to access them or were living in places with broadband blackouts. There is a reality we have to think about in terms of what is required for people and the fact the answer will not always be day services, residential care or nursing homes. We need to think about the other models we want to put in place.

Senator Higgins spoke about ambition and aiming high. In the context of an implementation plan, we should look at each convention article and name the multiple Departments that will have a responsibility to deliver on that article. There is also a need to name any challenges that arise between two Departments or agencies working together that are hampering the delivery of an article. An expectation should then be put in place, over two years, four years and six years, around where they need to get to in achieving that delivery, and that is what people will be brought before the committee to discuss.