Mr. Colm O'Donnell:

Senator Lombard and Deputy Michael Collins spoke about the convergence of payments and taking money from one part of a county to the other. It was stated that only 34% of farms are viable. For the record, viable farms are defined by Teagasc as farms that can support a labour unit. The vast majority of farms are in the sustainable and vulnerable sector. For those farmers, convergence would be make a difference when it comes to making them more sustainable - and not before time.

We are back where payments are linked to historic references dating back to 2001 and 2002. I suppose it is getting the mix right.

Senator Boyhan was wondering about the alignment of the CAP and the European Green Deal. Designations on land as a way of ensuring environmental dividends does not work. It has not worked in the past. The Natura 2000 designations have been a failure for both the farmer and the environment. Reports back to the Commission from the National Parks and Wildlife Service shows a deterioration in all the habitats that were supposed to be pristine and in good condition and to keep them as such. Therefore, that has not worked for Ireland. I am afraid where we are going down here again under the biodiversity strategy will not work for farmers. It has proven not to work in the past. The previous document, the prioritised action framework document that was signed off by Government as an assessment tool for funding for areas under designation, has no mention of the biodiversity strategy or the impact of it.

Mr. Cullinan spoke about an assessment of the impact of the farm to fork and, indeed, the biodiversity strategy and this needs to be done. Now is the time to ensure that we do not have a situation where as a result of a proposal in the Council's position under GAEC 2, it slides off the land and leaves it that it has to come back in under a derogation to be paid on. In the Department's presentation, it is assuring the Houses that these areas will be eligible for CAP payments. To receive those CAP payments, they have to be deemed not to be an agricultural area. This is unprecedented. This is the first time this has happened in the history of the State. The committee has been informed of the potential here. Derogations do not work. They come and they go. Such fundamental change here will have adverse effects. I cannot overstress that.