Ms Eilis Barry:

That is right. When the legal aid scheme, through the Legal Aid Board, was set up, it did not reflect what the Pringle report recommended and it was set up on a limited basis. It has proved extraordinarily difficult to convince the Oireachtas that legal aid needs to be invested in, as do the courts. There has been incremental change but it is very hard to get substantive change in the provision of legal aid.